Be forewarned :I’m the defender of Christianity. Repent I say.

[Cavebear]

You know nothing about my childhood, my home life, how I was raised and who did the raising.  And you have the gall to make a statement like this.  Well, there's a good reason do dismiss anything and everything you have said and will say.

As for my intestinal fortitude to stand on my own ground and on my own positions -- I so do.  I state in your face that there is no god and that you are deluding yourself.  If there is a divine authority of any sort, let him/her/it/them demonstrate it.  Until then, you yourself have nothing to stand on.

If you don't like the fact -- yes, fact -- that your church defends the rapists and not the victims, that's your problem and I can only feel sorry for someone so completely and blindly indoctrinated that they are no longer capable of simple human decency and empathy.

Lastly, I would show you my "certificate" (they're actually called diplomas -- you're welcome), but based on your writing 'style' I'm not convinced you're sufficiently literate to be able actually read it.  Let's see yours first.

Well said.  Hear hear!

[Mike Cl]

Cavebear . I am not here to convert anyone . Atheists talk bad  about  my religion and I have a right to criticize them  .   .
But do have you anything to say about my OP and my responses on this thread ?

Say assumptions are mistaken not unlikely . Calm  down . okay. Go have some ice cream and come back. Then carefully read my post.

I’ll have you know Barouch is my friend and I’m working to make Mike my friend and unblivered my friend too.  and even if you are “us”  there is silent majority out there reading . many more than your bunch of wankers . right?

Do not worry about Mohammed . he has his followers to defend him.

Do you take medication ? sedatives ? maybe you shouldn’t be here .

Look I stay in my posts . I do not venture out of them . just ignore them if you find them that stressful to you.

I am not Cavebear.  But what you post is always inane.  It has no meaning.  And I now mostly don't read them--never all of them.  it's not stressful, for you are more of a comic relief than anything.  You talk fictional stuff and expect to stress us????  You are a blow fish and just blowviates--and that is as good as you get.

[Munch]

look, the guy is a religious troll, which is how most of the worst kinds of preachers are, learning the ways of gum gabbing, or in this case mangled text, because throwing verbal diarrhea at people either online or irl is the only means of achieve external validation for themselves.

An intelligent person is one who can listen as well as speak, process it, and adapt. When you lose the ability to empathize with others, find a middle ground in conversation, and just want to yell at them from your bubble, they are not worth bothering with.

[Cavebear]

Impressive posts both of you, Munch and Mike CL.  Loved them.

[Blackleaf]

So you agree all the biblical writings were created well after the claimed times?  Impressive admission.  A step in the right direction.

Baruch isn't a Christian nutcase. He's an altogether different kind of nut. lol. He agrees that the Bible is BS, at least as far as history is concerned. He even considers god to be malevolent, but then he also believes all us are demigods, so he's probably also saying that we're malevolent. Just be sure you don't lump him in with the other theists. He's very atypical.

[Munch]

and thats why I appreciate what he has to say.

[Cavebear]

Baruch isn't a Christian nutcase. He's an altogether different kind of nut. lol. He agrees that the Bible is BS, at least as far as history is concerned. He even considers god to be malevolent, but then he also believes all us are demigods, so he's probably also saying that we're malevolent. Just be sure you don't lump him in with the other theists. He's very atypical.

I agree that Baruch isn't your average theist.  But he still is one and don't forget that.  Just as the theists say "beware the clever atheist", I say "beware the clever theist". 

I have argued with Jesuits and he reminds me of them.

[Unbeliever]

Baruch could search for a black cat that isn't there in a dark room and find it.

[trdsf]

Tell you what, we're going to take another look at this post.  There's a few things in here that raise some serious red flags about its author.

Barbara Blaine, who was recently fired from snap. Check this  report by Chicago post and other outlets…

…. Rev. Joseph Jiang sued SNAP after the group falsely accused him of being a pedophile, a federal judge ruled that SNAP maliciously defamed him "negligently and with reckless disregard for the truth" and ordered that SNAP must "pay the reasonable expenses, including plaintiff's attorney's fees “  …”Other priests are suing for false accusations too…” .

Even if I posit for the sake of argument that Ms Blaine is a bad person, in what possible way does that justify or mitigate her being raped repeatedly by a priest when she was a minor?

Give it a rest. this bullshit about catholic  sexual abuse shit is outdated . you're  behind times  atheist high school drop outs. while it was not it was great stuff the Church used to promote itself. Thanks for making the church look like a victim . dummines.  .

Outdated, really?  I wasn't aware there was a theological statute of limitations.  So child rape by Catholic priests is okay now because the clock ran out.

Hey, slavery is outdated.  Guess that means it's okay now.

Here is a claim , I make. Take one city public school and the sexual abuse that occurs in that city school is more than all the sexual abuses that happen in all the catholic schools world wide combined . I’ve a question if sex abuse is so important to you shouldn’t you be more focused on public schools ? because its not about that . its about exploiting abuse to carry out your agenda .which makes you what ? scum of the earth . right?

Let's see your documentation that there's more sexual abuse in public schools than in Catholic schools.  You don't just get to make this statement and walk away without offering proof.

Back to Islamic madrasa school. You got a common phenomena there , what they call  Walad AL Shiekh .  that means child of Al Sheikh .every time you hear that phrase in reference to any of the madrasa  school kids then you conclude that’s the Sheikhs favorite sex toy  from among the rest of the other kids he molests sexually.  When a man grows up and does not get married , doesn’t like women, we call him walad al Shiekh .

There is another word for them which is Tyer . Tyer AL Shiekh he is called. It’s a teenage boy that the big time Sheikh sodomzies  and is part of  the Sheikh house hold. Here is a word of advice. If you want the Shiekh to sign the paper and the business contract  deal to go through make sure you keep your cool because that Tyer is there to be insolent and act up to intimidate you into  softening your negotiation in terms of royalties or whatever happen to be the case. Like something that happened in this forum. I slapped Mike and unbeliever came running in his defense . so you can look at it that .so  Mike is unibeliever Tyer . 

Ah, and because sexual abuse happens in other religions, it's okay when Catholic priests do it.

This is what religion does to people.  It makes someone whom I shall assume to otherwise be psychologically normal go out of their way to excuse the systematic rape of children and the protection of the rapists rather than the victims.  You realize you just attacked the victim, tried to handwave away the seriousness of the crime, and then tried to relativize the action by pointing at other places it happened?

Are you even dimly aware of just how evil a thing you've written here?

Is the phrase, "Yes, abuses were committed and the church has a lot of work to do to both punish the criminals and to regain the trust of the community" that impossible to say?

But no.  You pretend there is no abuse, or that your church is the victim.  You think that its okay for an adolescent girl to be repeatedly raped by a man she was told by her church to trust completely.  You think that it's okay even if it did happen because it happened in the past.  You think that it's okay because you make up a lie about it being as pervasive in non-religious schools so you can pretend to yourself that it's worse elsewhere.  You think that it's okay because other religions do it too.  And you wrap it all up with miscellaneous ad hominems and make up wild claims about people you can't possibly know about.

I repeat: this is what religion does to people.

Unless there is something structurally wrong with, or some gross injury you've suffered to, your brain, somewhere inside you is a morally normal person.  Please find him and put him back in charge of your self again.

[Cavebear]

Tell you what, we're going to take another look at this post.  There's a few things in here that raise some serious red flags about its author.

Even if I posit for the sake of argument that Ms Blaine is a bad person, in what possible way does that justify or mitigate her being raped repeatedly by a priest when she was a minor?

Outdated, really?  I wasn't aware there was a theological statute of limitations.  So child rape by Catholic priests is okay now because the clock ran out.

Hey, slavery is outdated.  Guess that means it's okay now.

Let's see your documentation that there's more sexual abuse in public schools than in Catholic schools.  You don't just get to make this statement and walk away without offering proof.

Ah, and because sexual abuse happens in other religions, it's okay when Catholic priests do it.

This is what religion does to people.  It makes someone whom I shall assume to otherwise be psychologically normal go out of their way to excuse the systematic rape of children and the protection of the rapists rather than the victims.  You realize you just attacked the victim, tried to handwave away the seriousness of the crime, and then tried to relativize the action by pointing at other places it happened?

Are you even dimly aware of just how evil a thing you've written here?

Is the phrase, "Yes, abuses were committed and the church has a lot of work to do to both punish the criminals and to regain the trust of the community" that impossible to say?

But no.  You pretend there is no abuse, or that your church is the victim.  You think that its okay for an adolescent girl to be repeatedly raped by a man she was told by her church to trust completely.  You think that it's okay even if it did happen because it happened in the past.  You think that it's okay because you make up a lie about it being as pervasive in non-religious schools so you can pretend to yourself that it's worse elsewhere.  You think that it's okay because other religions do it too.  And you wrap it all up with miscellaneous ad hominems and make up wild claims about people you can't possibly know about.

I repeat: this is what religion does to people.

Unless there is something structurally wrong with, or some gross injury you've suffered to, your brain, somewhere inside you is a morally normal person.  Please find him and put him back in charge of your self again.

I agree.  Religiosity is not a reason to forgive crimes.  They get away with too much. 

As the police should be most punished for committing crimes and laywers for breaking the law, religious shamans should be held very accountable for moral failings.  It's their jobs and trusted in those aspects.

[Unbeliever]

Some people seek such positions of trust in order to better get away with their nefarious schemes. Once they're above suspicion they need to be more closely watched, but society hasn't figured that out yet.

[Cavebear]

Some people seek such positions of trust in order to better get away with their nefarious schemes. Once they're above suspicion they need to be more closely watched, but society hasn't figured that out yet.

Some of us have...

[Hijiri Byakuren]

[Cavebear]

Love.  Give me a "ready room" summary later.  LOL!

[Ibn Khaldun]

Okay what is it  this time ? you are exasperating you know that ? aaaah 

Once again you have failed to address my op. I cited you as ones who claim that bible was copied from pagan religions and I trampled on  those claims made by atheists  and trashed them  and showed they were  bullshit  .that is a fact. I whipped you and stomped on you. Every time you open your big mouth without addressing my OP it  is another TK delivered by me and shows you for the bunch of phony pretenders that you are . you got nothing to offer but fast talk and personal attacks and the amazing thing you talk about my English when you know its my second language and when you yourself can’t  form proper sentences and screw up on shit like conditional clauses like that clown Mike or cavebear who says assumptions are unlikely . you can’t even speak properly in your own native tongues .guys I beat you in your medium . what more can I do ? .  .

Trdsf. You’re little too little and a little too late . that Barabra crap  that was about who you are . And stop flattering yourself .  who cares about your life . I don’t care . I was talking about your Barbara bullshit . in  context of you . as to your childhood , I guess single parent broken home shit . what else ?you wanna talk about it ? not interested . take it up with a shrink . I couldn’t careless .

yes you’re programmed robot. You heard about  her  from one of your numbers and swallowed the shit hook and bait  . . that says you are high school drop out.  you are bar talk . you are repeating machine . I don’t have to know your history  to tell that you are . that Barbara shit is enough to define  you as repeating machine . in real life I would tell you do not call us , we will call you and then throw your file in the  trash .that blunder by  you is  indication you are high school drop out . you have never been to an interview except maybe to get you criminal record checked . there are no second chances . you got caught with your pants down.

I want to ask you a question . why are you talking to me about this when the OP is talking about something else? Don ‘t you feel funny about that ?is it because you are corrupt and lack honor ? you don’t even know it .

Look here is the  way I feel about it .  your European or American catholic priest  is you . they came from you.  you are the problem. That’s who you are and what you do.  I don’t go for that shit this is the priest and this is you. I don’t see that distinction. You do it in church , you do it in the police, in school , in colleges any fucking where .you’re decadent society about to wither away and disappear . I'm sorry . really am

Look at that cavebear . cavebear in my introduction post said he researched surat al fateha in Wikipedia and based on that research he gave a totally false account of surat al fateha . total bullshit and yet still cavebear has no problem showing its  face here . that’s who you are .

you lack honor and its  no surprise you turn priests like you .  you’re the problem . and the good news there are fewer and fewer of your defective kind joining the ranks and soon we will be rid of you and move the Vatican to Africa. End of story
You are woody Allen. You screw the woman then her mother and you marry your adopted daughter and you applaud and celebrate him .Islam is the way for you .  .

Don’t give me this shit about priests and shit because you are not different from them and I bet much worse. They come from you for god sake . save the crocodile tears for someone else .there is nothing you can tell me about you. I lived among you and I know . fix yourself first then your priest will be fixed . but you can’t .

all the same you made a decent effort . for someone with your challenges I admire that . . Look just one catholic parish is pretty complicated set up. I’ve been consulted once or twice .  I looked , there are problems but solutions are hard .the church is the first to admit that there are no solutions because you can’t be fixed. .

they are not really as “core “ based as you think. There’re  many competing factions within ., its an extremely delicate balance and they don’t have an army and they are spread world wide under different jurisprudences and  lot of the  shit  are actually self reliant . those parishes in third world countries are . .

you have no idea how complex the shit is . it boggles my mind that catholic church can keep it  together  . its like a miracle in a way .

identifying the problem is no big deal. The problem are the solutions and the benefits from them .

did you see when the Pope visits third world countries they come out in  the hundred of thousands to greet him ? its food formula, health care ,fuel,  education and and and , not to mention other shit  that can kill people by the millions .  . that shit of coming out in large numbers gives the Pope the sort of clout that comes in handy

. and then you got to throw in the various orders and orgs within orgs and all the other shit I won’t speak about and the politics . shit the politics how devious that shit is.  layered shit on top of each there . .  they twist the arms of the Vatican  . you got layered shit on top of each other from so many powers that be out there .

  there’re  no solutions and I am totally with you on pedophiles should be exterminated and exposed and punishing those who protect them or cover for them  .  kill them all.  sound the  drums and gather the people and onward with the procession to the public square . stab him in the  side so he  stoops over and  sticks his head out and cut it off .throw his body to the animals to feed on. No loose ends . kill the victim too and the parents for not watching out . End of story

but with the shit the way it is , what I do is take precaution my kids are safe . those who get run over what can I do ? snakes are going to be there and you go after them you do what you call throw the baby with the bath water .

look I have to handle  people . of course nothing like something like the Vatican and I don’t  know what to do  often times . there are  no fucking solutions in this world . shit comes at me like train rumbling at hundred miles an hour with no brakes. I don’t do something , it hits the station and kill everyone. I do something it hits a house kills less people but kill people still. This is something lay shit like you never has to handle .

you want to break up the church . I don’t . I say to get rid of you and take the church from you . you don’t deserve a church . you should be churchless. You are doomed anyways . you don’t have to be hit by a flood . you will flood yourself by yourself out of existence .its okay . there’re  plenty people . 7 billion of them .

the trick is how we gonna do it so we don’t end up with you . I mean you got cities with something like 20 % sexually deviant people in the west . I calculate its the schools , those public schools specially . it goes back to them . catholic schools in third world countries and specially in Africa have hardly those issues that are destroying your society . in other words we don’t have you . we didn’t and  don’t produce you .

the question is how to keep you  from happening . how to only produce people like me .

in cattle herder society in Africa , homosexuality is non existent. I mean extremely rare. The cultural drive is pro creational overwhelmingly. Alpha males do most of the breeding . the system automatically eliminates the funny shit  . the kids are also extremely pro creational to the extent they kidnap their own dads women if they can’t get any . and they inherit their dad women. How not to fuck up such males pool is the challenge and make sure you don’t pop up. .

African bishops tried to make move . didn’t work. His Holiness Pope Francis got the seat. If this continues African churches will separate from you . you are irrelevant now as far as the catholic church and its future is concerned . you will be swallowed by Islam . that’s a foregone conclusion. I’m thinking about it . I will let you know if I figure it out .
Don’t see any reason to talk to you on this. Bye