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questions and answers anyone?

Started by Drich0150, June 15, 2017, 05:41:12 PM

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Baruch

Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Baruch

Quote from: Cavebear on June 18, 2017, 03:36:36 AM
Truth is a concern to me, and it doesn't come from the superstitious writings of primitive nomadic people living 2000+ years ago.  While your kind were wasting food and sacrificing sons to a deity whose existence couldn't and cannot now be proven, other people were exploring geometry, measuring the size of the Earth, and writing books of facts, not fiction.

But you are a believer convinced of your own facts.  So, lets see some facts.

1.  Prove Jesus actually existed.
2.  Prove Masada actually happened.
3.  Prove the Flood.
4.  Adam and Eve had 3 sons.  Where did their wives come from?
5.  If the Universe CAN occur naturally (and it can), why is a deity required for it?

Well Masada clearly exists, though we don't have a VHS videotape or iPhone video of the battle.  Do you doubt that Gettysburg happened?

But the others are fictional, including Moses and Jesus.  But this Muhammad guy, he was real, and is still in your face 1400 years later.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Drich0150

Quote from: Blackleaf on June 16, 2017, 05:04:30 PM
Kid, I know more about the Bible than you do.
That maybe.

QuoteI was as genuine as they came. I did not quit because things got hard. I didn't quit because God didn't grant me special favors in exchange for my works. I left because God was completely absent in my life.
is what I mean when I say God sends the wind and rain to test what you have built.. to test your faith.. to see/show you if your efforts are being supported by God.
Quote
He did not grant relief when I needed it and asked for it. Instead, things just kept getting worse.
I'm sorry to hear that. Know I have been on both ends of that.

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Mathew 7:9:11 - "Which of you, if your son asks for bread, will give him a stone? Or if he asks for a fish, will give him a snake? If you, then, though you are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will your Father in heaven give good gifts to those who ask him!"
Even the Bible is proof against God.
If you are a bible geneus you'd know that is a cherry pick line hack out of the bible to paint an incomplete picture.
lets look at the whole pcture/what it is you are supposed to be asking for:

5-6 Then Jesus said to them, “Suppose one of you went to your friend’s house very late at night and said to him, ‘A friend of mine has come into town to visit me. But I have nothing for him to eat. Please give me three loaves of bread.’ 7 Your friend inside the house answers, ‘Go away! Don’t bother me! The door is already locked. My children and I are in bed. I cannot get up and give you the bread now.’ 8 I tell you, maybe friendship is not enough to make him get up to give you the bread. But he will surely get up to give you what you need if you continue to ask. 9 So I tell you, continue to ask, and God will give to you. Continue to search, and you will find. Continue to knock, and the door will open for you. 10 Yes, whoever continues to ask will receive. Whoever continues to look will find. And whoever continues to knock will have the door opened for them. 11 Do any of you have a son? What would you do if your son asked you for a fish? Would any father give him a snake? 12 Or, if he asked for an egg, would you give him a scorpion? Of course not! 13 Even you who are bad know how to give good things to your children. So surely your heavenly Father knows how to give the Holy Spirit to the people who ask him.”

Did you see that last bit? you are supposed to have been asking for the Holy Spirit, not whatever crap it is you were looking for. Even so God did answer your 'ask prayer' as if you were looking for the Holy Spirit, in that he destroyed your picture of the false God you had modeled from the bible. That way you would have an oppertunity to build a correct pic with the Holy Spirit.

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And if you weren't so blinded by your faith, you would be able to see that. You might start to wonder why God, who is omniscient and supposedly hears all of your prayers, will not speak when spoken to, and why he'd rather communicate through silence and make it impossible to know whether it's him or your imagination.
I didn't have this problem... in fact many of the people I know have has some sort of connection or contact with God. That is the only reason most of them including myself are on this side of the fence. we have all seen and heard/experience far too much to be told God is silent. Maybe for you maybe in name it and claim it land... but if your actually into the bible, and did not build a pic og God based on Aladdin's lamp then things maybe alittle different.

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You might wonder why the only evidence that God gives of his existence is a collection of historically inaccurate books, which are so obscure that millions of people argue about what they even mean.
I will share some of my experiences in up and comming posts. All I can say for the mment is God is not silent... Or rather the God of the bible is not silent.. Your God maybe, but as we are told gods built on sand often are.
1Thess 5:21 Question all things and hold on to what is Good. This is a charge meant for those who think themselves Christian. We are to question the foundational as well as the questionable, and hold on to the truth. Because I've done this my answers may be... Different than the typical Christian

Drich0150

Quote from: Baruch on June 16, 2017, 06:01:26 PM
Dirch ... do you live like this?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Year_of_Living_Biblically

I gave you two likes, for part of two posts you made ... I expect to be crucified for it ;-( ... this is a rough crowd you have come to, like the Cantina at Mos Eisley.

No I am not a legalist..

And good thing I brought my blaster... though if you think about it luke, the droids, han and obi wan were the instigators in all the cantina's shenanigans.
1Thess 5:21 Question all things and hold on to what is Good. This is a charge meant for those who think themselves Christian. We are to question the foundational as well as the questionable, and hold on to the truth. Because I've done this my answers may be... Different than the typical Christian

Drich0150

Quote from: Baruch on June 16, 2017, 11:15:04 PM
As long as you leave my "peter" alone, I am good with that.  Gravity boots.

For DRich - here is some education for you ... the howlers/mistranslations in Christian and Jewish Bibles ... as corrected in the Aramaic

http://www.aramaicbibleperspectives.com/uploads/Aramaic_Bible_Institute_Dictionary_1-20-13.pdf

Unfortunately most people's access to scripture is thru translations, filtered thru the accidental distortions of translators and deliberate distortions of theologians.

Sooo.... Koine Greek (semi dead language) to modern english translations are wrong... but Koine greek to Aramaic (completely dead language) to Modern english... those are right... Yeah..

You get Aramaic while spoken was a dialect it was not an official language right? didn't have an official text, which is why EVERYTHING in that period was written in the official empirical standard language and not in 100 regional dialects??

That to have text in Aramaic is to have a letter written in creol or enjun in english?
1Thess 5:21 Question all things and hold on to what is Good. This is a charge meant for those who think themselves Christian. We are to question the foundational as well as the questionable, and hold on to the truth. Because I've done this my answers may be... Different than the typical Christian

Drich0150

Quote from: fencerider on June 17, 2017, 02:58:06 PM
I didn't have any paleo-Hebrew class in elementary school and there aren't many paleo-Hebrew manuscripts sitting around for us to read, so I assume you mean an English translation. Which English version of the Bible are you referring to?

I suppose the first question should be how many errors, contradictions, or lies do you think are in the Bible? of course we know that every English version has translation errors...

I'm open to consider any you may think you have found, but I have yet found one I haven't been able to resolve with a correct reading.
1Thess 5:21 Question all things and hold on to what is Good. This is a charge meant for those who think themselves Christian. We are to question the foundational as well as the questionable, and hold on to the truth. Because I've done this my answers may be... Different than the typical Christian

Drich0150

Quote from: Baruch on June 17, 2017, 03:11:40 PM
The Hebrew-Aramaic version, the original, as vowel pointed by the Masortes in around 950 CE ... has errors too.  The most original (Dead Sea scrolls versions of individual books in Hebrew, often just fragments) don't have vowels fully indicated (neither did the earliest Quran).  For much of the Christian world, the original OT bible is the Septuagint, but that is itself a translation.  Other early translations of the OT include several versions in Aramaic.

http://www.biblicalarchaeology.org/daily/biblical-topics/hebrew-bible/what-is-the-oldest-hebrew-bible/

scratch what I said earlier, I get what you are saying now in that the OT version found in Aramaic are indeed older that what was found in the koine greek. whether all of those passages are more authentic or reliable are yet to be seen.
1Thess 5:21 Question all things and hold on to what is Good. This is a charge meant for those who think themselves Christian. We are to question the foundational as well as the questionable, and hold on to the truth. Because I've done this my answers may be... Different than the typical Christian

Drich0150

Quote from: Cavebear on June 18, 2017, 03:36:36 AM
Truth is a concern to me, and it doesn't come from the superstitious writings of primitive nomadic people living 2000+ years ago.  While your kind were wasting food and sacrificing sons to a deity whose existence couldn't and cannot now be proven, other people were exploring geometry, measuring the size of the Earth, and writing books of facts, not fiction.

But you are a believer convinced of your own facts.  So, lets see some facts.

1.  Prove Jesus actually existed.
There are more manuscripts written on Christ than any other historical figure of that time period. To question the authenctity of Christ is to call in to question if there was ever a julius ceasar as again more is recorded about Christ!
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2.  Prove Masada actually happened.
https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/masada-desert-fortress
Josephus seems to be on board.
Quote
3.  Prove the Flood.
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/evidence-suggests-biblical-great-flood-noahs-time-happened/story?id=17884533

Quote
4.  Adam and Eve had 3 sons.
the bible said they eventually had more sons and daughters.

QuoteWhere did their wives come from?
From the monkey people who evolved outside the garden while Adam and eve were safe inside apart from all of the rest of creation.
Quote
5.  If the Universe CAN occur naturally (and it can), why is a deity required for it?
and if it can't?
1Thess 5:21 Question all things and hold on to what is Good. This is a charge meant for those who think themselves Christian. We are to question the foundational as well as the questionable, and hold on to the truth. Because I've done this my answers may be... Different than the typical Christian

Blackleaf

#53
Quote from: Drich0150 on June 19, 2017, 03:17:15 PMis what I mean when I say God sends the wind and rain to test what you have built.. to test your faith.. to see/show you if your efforts are being supported by God.

Yes. That is what people kept telling me, and it's what I believed myself. So then God is too incompetent to know when I am being pushed to far, to know when "testing" will only be counterproductive, and giving relief would prevent one of his own from falling away.

Quote from: Drich0150 on June 19, 2017, 03:17:15 PMIf you are a bible geneus you'd know that is a cherry pick line hack out of the bible to paint an incomplete picture.
lets look at the whole pcture/what it is you are supposed to be asking for:

5-6 Then Jesus said to them, “Suppose one of you went to your friend’s house very late at night and said to him, ‘A friend of mine has come into town to visit me. But I have nothing for him to eat. Please give me three loaves of bread.’ 7 Your friend inside the house answers, ‘Go away! Don’t bother me! The door is already locked. My children and I are in bed. I cannot get up and give you the bread now.’ 8 I tell you, maybe friendship is not enough to make him get up to give you the bread. But he will surely get up to give you what you need if you continue to ask. 9 So I tell you, continue to ask, and God will give to you. Continue to search, and you will find. Continue to knock, and the door will open for you. 10 Yes, whoever continues to ask will receive. Whoever continues to look will find. And whoever continues to knock will have the door opened for them. 11 Do any of you have a son? What would you do if your son asked you for a fish? Would any father give him a snake? 12 Or, if he asked for an egg, would you give him a scorpion? Of course not! 13 Even you who are bad know how to give good things to your children. So surely your heavenly Father knows how to give the Holy Spirit to the people who ask him.”

Did you see that last bit? you are supposed to have been asking for the Holy Spirit, not whatever crap it is you were looking for. Even so God did answer your 'ask prayer' as if you were looking for the Holy Spirit, in that he destroyed your picture of the false God you had modeled from the bible. That way you would have an oppertunity to build a correct pic with the Holy Spirit.

Now look who's cherrypicking. What one paragraph says is inconvenient for you, so you pick out another verse and ignore what the other one says. Read the verses I quoted again. It says that a good father will provide for his son. He will provide food, not stones which do not help, or snakes that hurt you. He gives "good gifts" to those who ask for it. The author was not limiting these requests to the Holy Spirit. In fact, you've demonstrated that you do not even understand your own quote well. In my quote, the author says that God is not a bad father. He provides what his children need when they ask for it. Your quote says that God is not a bad neighbor, who will only grant your request after you've irritated him to the point of exhaustion. There is no inconvenient time to ask him. He will grant your request the first time you ask. Yet in my experience, I asked repeatedly for God to give me the relief that I needed, and he continued to ignore me, proving he is worse than the neighbor and the father in both quotes. He is not a "Heavenly Father" of infinite love. And by the way, I did ask for the Holy Spirit, but apparently it didn't work if he didn't provide me with the wisdom of the Bible he gave to you.

Quote from: Drich0150 on June 19, 2017, 03:17:15 PMI didn't have this problem... in fact many of the people I know have has some sort of connection or contact with God. That is the only reason most of them including myself are on this side of the fence. we have all seen and heard/experience far too much to be told God is silent. Maybe for you maybe in name it and claim it land... but if your actually into the bible, and did not build a pic og God based on Aladdin's lamp then things maybe alittle different.

Once again, you set a strawman for yourself to push over. Never once did I claim that God was like a genie in a lamp, ready to grant whatever crazy requests I made. I asked for my basic needs, and he responded with silence. But getting back on topic, are you claiming that God has spoken to you in an audible voice, not through silence?

Quote from: Drich0150 on June 19, 2017, 03:17:15 PMI will share some of my experiences in up and comming posts. All I can say for the mment is God is not silent... Or rather the God of the bible is not silent.. Your God maybe, but as we are told gods built on sand often are.

Stop doing that. My God was not "built on sand." My God was a Biblically accurate God, similar to yours. Stop building these strawmen to dismiss what I have to say. Also, I find it quite telling that you choose to ignore the entire point of the quote you made. In the same paragraph, you say that God is not silent, then admit that he is, and that he uses the Bible to communicate. And what was the problem with God choosing to communicate through the Bible that I pointed out? It's historically inaccurate. So God, with his infinite power and wisdom, who could easily just speak when spoken to without any trouble, chooses instead to communicate with us exclusively through a flawed and vague collection of books. Actually, even that's putting it too lightly. It's a flawed translation/transliteration of a flawed collection of old books. And you see no problems with that?

EDIT: And one last point. Last I checked, the pages in the Bible are still silent. The Bible does not flap its covers and speak.
"Oh, wearisome condition of humanity,
Born under one law, to another bound;
Vainly begot, and yet forbidden vanity,
Created sick, commanded to be sound."
--Fulke Greville--

Drich0150

Quote from: Blackleaf on June 19, 2017, 04:02:48 PM
Yes. That is what people kept telling me, and it's what I believed myself. So then God is too incompetent to know when I am being pushed to far, to know when "testing" will only be counterproductive, and giving relief would prevent one of his own from falling away.
...And what was the prodigal son all about? was it about a dad so determined to love his little snow flake so much he hugged and kissed him till he stayed home, or did the old man cut the little a-hole a check and let him leave?

You staying was never part of the plan ever dude. it's all been spelled out in these parables you know so well but don't know at all.

Your atheism like mine was an answer to a prayer

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Now look who's cherrypicking.
read the whole chapter bruh... 1-5 or whatever is the lord's prayer everything after that has to do with Jesus Healing a demon.. so how is that cherry picking if the context of the stroy before and the story after do not support the text?

That was why you were called out on cherry picking. you stopped at "what father would give a scorpion if he was asked for an egg, so how much more would your father in heaven ask of you if.... (that is what you left out!) IF you Ask for the Holy Spirit. That is the secret to all of this! If you ask for the Holy Spirit GOD HIMSELF With you Proofs all of this for you!

one more time IF you A/S/K as outlined in Luke 11 God the Father will send God the Holy Spirit This can be a physical one on one thing. IT WAS FOR ME! (Ill post a different thread on that mods willing)

That is how I know all of the bible is true, because in it you are allowed to test God. If you simply do what the bible asks God... Shows up.

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What one paragraph says is inconvenient for you, so you pick out another verse and ignore what the other one says. Read the verses I quoted again. It says that a good father will provide for his son. He will provide food, not stones which do not help, or snakes that hurt you. He gives "good gifts" to those who ask for it.
"Good gifts"=Holy Spirit. Why? because none other than God are 'good.' I could go on and preach why all and list a whole bunch of scripture, Jesus referenced about people not being Good, how the things of this world will varnish and or rust away, but what is ever lasting and Good is only God.
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The author was not limiting these requests to the Holy Spirit.
Jesus when he spoke the same message in luke 11 spelled out exactly what he means. or do you suggest he used the same run up and format to describe something else completely?
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In fact, you've demonstrated that you do not even understand your own quote well. In my quote, the author says that God is not a bad father. He provides what his children need when they ask for it. Your quote says that God is not a bad neighbor, who will only grant your request after you've irritated him to the point of exhaustion.
look sport it is the same exact message. the only difference is that Jesus tells us what "the good gift is"
11 Do any of you have a son? What would you do if your son asked you for a fish? Would any father give him a snake? 12 Or, if he asked for an egg, would you give him a scorpion? Of course not! 13 Even you who are bad know how to give good things to your children. So surely your heavenly Father knows how to give the Holy Spirit to the people who ask him.”

Everything is word for word the only difference is Jesus Himself deciphers this 'good gift' so a-holes can't argue what he meant.
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There is no inconvenient time to ask him. He will grant your request the first time you ask. Yet in my experience, I asked repeatedly for God to give me the relief that I needed, and he continued to ignore me, proving he is worse than the neighbor and the father in both quotes. He is not a "Heavenly Father" of infinite love. And by the way, I did ask for the Holy Spirit, but apparently it didn't work if he didn't provide me with the wisdom of the Bible he gave to you.
and again how do you know Atheism is simply not apart of your journey to getting what you asked for? What if that first step was to show you, in all  your biblical 'genus' (your word not mine) you had it all wrong and the only way you would fully accept that is to allow your version of God to fill your needs so that in the end you would seek the God outlined in scripture?
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Once again, you set a strawman for yourself to push over. Never once did I claim that God was like a genie in a lamp, ready to grant whatever crazy requests I made.
wait a tick... didn't you just say you asked God for a bla bla bla and didn't get it so you left... It's that what you do when the genie stops granting wishes? you leave? so what would you do if he gave you a woman to help 'aliviate' your situation? would you have then stayed and continue to worship your version of God till he stops granting wishes??? so tell me again how this was a strawman arguement? God grants wishes yu stay, God stops granting wishes you leave.. that's how genie's and magic lamps work no???

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I asked for my basic needs, and he responded with silence. But getting back on topic, are you claiming that God has spoken to you in an audible voice, not through silence?
He sent a literal messenger.. will post tomorrow about it mods willing.
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Stop doing that. My God was not "built on sand."
Dude seriously if he weren't you would not be here. God does give us all we need and if that is with an audience with Him then that is what we get. we just need to do what He says first. look at thomas needed to stick his hand in his side. did Jesus throw him away because he lost faith? no he let him put his poop crusted hand in his open wound (they didnt have TP back then) Paul was so zeolus for Jesus He had to be blinded to be stopped and rather than Jesus throw Him away he sat and spoke with Him turn Him around and sent Him on His way. the same is true for the rest of us. I am no one special. I've done nothing deserving of any of this, but because I needed and wanted the truth above all else God showed it to me.
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My God was a Biblically accurate God, similar to yours.
my God was just short of blaspheme of the Holy Spirit.. you don't want to know what or how I worshiped before. After I truly sought God I let God be who God was. meaning he killed philistine babies then good! or if he send a bear to maul some little bastards awesome! I'm more of a darth vader fan than a new jedi girl hero any friggen way. Then over time I could see connections between why or How God did something in the NT that did not jive with the old and it made since because I did not try and make excuses for anything God did. Then a whole new wrld of understanding opened up for me.

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Stop building these strawmen to dismiss what I have to say. Also, I find it quite telling that you choose to ignore the entire point of the quote you made. In the same paragraph, you say that God is not silent, then admit that he is, and that he uses the Bible to communicate.
Just not allowed to preach sport read the rules If I start off with God told me this and God told me that I'd be out of here. but if someone asks I can talk about how God works with in the frame work of your question. Not my rules but I will try and work with them.
We need the bible to decern who it is that is speaking with us. because once you cross a spiritual line you will quickly find God/HS is not the only thing out there leaving messages. or giving you information. The bible is you only hope in discerning truth. Again it all circles back to truth and a strong desire to know it absolutely. It is so easy for the other ones to take a 1/2 truth and send you off 1/2 cocked in to a crowd of people with a bomb strapped to your behind. Or do you really think they are just so religious they don't know how to think for themselves any more? Some maybe but most they've seen and felt what I have, but the herion/crack version of God's love rather than the real thing. I'll leave it at that till I get another question. (don't want preach/scare/offend anyone out of complacency in their theologies)

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And what was the problem with God choosing to communicate through the Bible that I pointed out?
Nothing if you read it with a thirst for truth. However if you are going to read it with a slant. Like you telling me what a good gift was even after Jesus in an exact same set up in luke 11 tells us himself what the good gift your are supposed to be asking for is!!! I mean come ne word for word for 2 verses and instead of the ambiguous "good gift" he says Holy Spirit. A truth seeker has to default to Holy Spirit.. Why? Because did you get your good gift? now ask me if I got the Holy Spirit?

QuoteIt's historically inaccurate.
History is historically inaccurate, so what specifically sets the bible apart?

QuoteSo God, with his infinite power and wisdom, who could easily just speak when spoken to without any trouble, chooses instead to communicate with us exclusively through a flawed and vague collection of books.
well yeah! look how stupid we are in religion. God clearly tell us not to make any graven images and do not worship idols even of Him!!! look at the "Artwork" in the church. Look at the shroud that supposedly entombed Christ's body, look at the bones of certain apstoles and how they are dunked in water for people to drink... look at all the crazy B/S we do in the sake or name of 'religion.' Now imagine if we had an actual perfect relique of God. Tell me that you don't think we as a people would worship that book as God... People do that now with some translations!!

The bible is nothing more than a tool to find God. if you seek truth if you seek perfection if you seek everything the bible is not supposed to be but God is then seek God first, don't seek to worship a stupid book. That said remember that book is the key to descern who God is and who is not.

QuoteActually, even that's putting it too lightly. It's a flawed translation/transliteration of a flawed collection of old books. And you see no problems with that?
because un like you I do not seek nor ever sought to worship a book. the book is just a gps to God. All it need do is get me close.

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EDIT: And one last point. Last I checked, the pages in the Bible are still silent. The Bible does not flap its covers and speak.
nor was it supposed to.. if it were then we would be directed to worship the book instead of God directly like the jews were.
1Thess 5:21 Question all things and hold on to what is Good. This is a charge meant for those who think themselves Christian. We are to question the foundational as well as the questionable, and hold on to the truth. Because I've done this my answers may be... Different than the typical Christian

Mike Cl

Okay, Drich, here is a bit of a contradiction:

Every Decalogue you see â€" from the 5,000-pound granite behemoth inside the Alabama State Judicial Building to the little wallet-cards sold at Christian bookstores â€" is bogus. Simply reading the Bible will prove this. Getting out your King James version, turn to Exodus 20:2-17. You’ll see the familiar list of rules about having no other gods, honoring your parents, not killing or coveting,
and so on. At this point, though, Moses is just repeating to the people what God told him on Mount Si’nai. These are not written down in any form.

Later, Moses goes back to the Mount, where God gives him two “tables of stone” with rules written on them (Exodus 31:18). But when Moses comes down the mountain lugging his load, he sees the people worshipping a statue of a calf, causing him to throw a tantrum and smash the tablets on the ground (Exodus 32:19).

In neither of these cases does the Bible refer to “commandments.” In the first instance, they are “words” which “God spake,” while the tablets contain “testimony.” It is only when Moses goes back for new tablets that we see the phrase “ten commandments” (Exodus 34:28). In an interesting turn of events, the commandments on these tablets are significantly different than the ten rules Moses recited for the people, meaning that either Moses’ memory is faulty or God changed his mind.

I. Thou shalt worship no other god.

II. Thou shalt make thee no molten gods.

III. The feast of unleavened bread thou shalt keep.

IV. Six days thou shalt work, but on the seventh day thou shalt rest.

V. Thou shalt observe the feast of weeks, of the firstfruits of wheat harvest,
and the feast of ingathering at the year’s end.

VI. Thrice in the year shall all your men children appear before the Lord God.

VII. Thou shalt not offer the blood of my sacrifice with leaven.

VIII. Neither shall the sacrifice of the feast of the passover be left unto the morning.

IX. The first of the firstfruits of thy land thou shalt bring unto the house of the LORD thy God.

X. Thou shalt not seethe a kid [ie, a young goat] in his mother’s milk.
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?<br />Then he is not omnipotent,<br />Is he able but not willing?<br />Then whence cometh evil?<br />Is he neither able or willing?<br />Then why call him god?

Drich0150

Quote from: Mike Cl on June 19, 2017, 05:34:25 PM
Okay, Drich, here is a bit of a contradiction:

Every Decalogue you see â€" from the 5,000-pound granite behemoth inside the Alabama State Judicial Building to the little wallet-cards sold at Christian bookstores â€" is bogus. Simply reading the Bible will prove this. Getting out your King James version, turn to Exodus 20:2-17. You’ll see the familiar list of rules about having no other gods, honoring your parents, not killing or coveting,
and so on. At this point, though, Moses is just repeating to the people what God told him on Mount Si’nai. These are not written down in any form.

Later, Moses goes back to the Mount, where God gives him two “tables of stone” with rules written on them (Exodus 31:18). But when Moses comes down the mountain lugging his load, he sees the people worshipping a statue of a calf, causing him to throw a tantrum and smash the tablets on the ground (Exodus 32:19).

In neither of these cases does the Bible refer to “commandments.” In the first instance, they are “words” which “God spake,” while the tablets contain “testimony.” It is only when Moses goes back for new tablets that we see the phrase “ten commandments” (Exodus 34:28). In an interesting turn of events, the commandments on these tablets are significantly different than the ten rules Moses recited for the people, meaning that either Moses’ memory is faulty or God changed his mind.

I. Thou shalt worship no other god.

II. Thou shalt make thee no molten gods.

III. The feast of unleavened bread thou shalt keep.

IV. Six days thou shalt work, but on the seventh day thou shalt rest.

V. Thou shalt observe the feast of weeks, of the firstfruits of wheat harvest,
and the feast of ingathering at the year’s end.

VI. Thrice in the year shall all your men children appear before the Lord God.

VII. Thou shalt not offer the blood of my sacrifice with leaven.

VIII. Neither shall the sacrifice of the feast of the passover be left unto the morning.

IX. The first of the firstfruits of thy land thou shalt bring unto the house of the LORD thy God.

X. Thou shalt not seethe a kid [ie, a young goat] in his mother’s milk.

Come one guys... it's like you guys to an atheist version of ross and you pick up last month arguement and pass them off as your own. Since I know you did not write this one I'm going to give you the cliff notes answer and see if you can chew on that...

turn to Exo 20 actually start on the back 1/2 of 19.

So moses goes up the mountain to get direction from God and the people want to see God too. so a few brave ones start to hassle moses and God starts giving commands to moses but the a-holes wont let them be.

So moses was to go get arron and tell the people the will die if they try and seek up to see God. So moses leaves and tells everyone.. must of got like alot of disrespect, because next thing chapter 20 God pipes up himself and lays down the 10 commandments... If God lays down 10 rules they are friggen commandments even if he does not call them that. that is why they are engraved everywhere.

So now the people (3 million or so) are like pooping their robes they are all scared to death, which is a problem because like no laundry mats and no ross'. So moses stays clams the people down, and later goes back for that second list. Now rather than God simply give his commandment which are apart of that list he tells the people what will happen if they obey and disobey... Do you get the difference? you've got the original commandment list and then you have a set of promises and conditions. That my friend is called a covenant. You keep my commands and this is what you will get. ou do abc I give 123... So the secondlist is a list of commandments and his covenant with moses and his people.

So now because we the US are not OT jews but NT Christians we do not live under that covenant, we live under the covenant of Christ, yet the commandments stand. which is why we have the first list and not the second
1Thess 5:21 Question all things and hold on to what is Good. This is a charge meant for those who think themselves Christian. We are to question the foundational as well as the questionable, and hold on to the truth. Because I've done this my answers may be... Different than the typical Christian

Baruch

Quote from: Mike Cl on June 19, 2017, 05:34:25 PM
Okay, Drich, here is a bit of a contradiction:

Every Decalogue you see â€" from the 5,000-pound granite behemoth inside the Alabama State Judicial Building to the little wallet-cards sold at Christian bookstores â€" is bogus. Simply reading the Bible will prove this. Getting out your King James version, turn to Exodus 20:2-17. You’ll see the familiar list of rules about having no other gods, honoring your parents, not killing or coveting,
and so on. At this point, though, Moses is just repeating to the people what God told him on Mount Si’nai. These are not written down in any form.

Later, Moses goes back to the Mount, where God gives him two “tables of stone” with rules written on them (Exodus 31:18). But when Moses comes down the mountain lugging his load, he sees the people worshipping a statue of a calf, causing him to throw a tantrum and smash the tablets on the ground (Exodus 32:19).

In neither of these cases does the Bible refer to “commandments.” In the first instance, they are “words” which “God spake,” while the tablets contain “testimony.” It is only when Moses goes back for new tablets that we see the phrase “ten commandments” (Exodus 34:28). In an interesting turn of events, the commandments on these tablets are significantly different than the ten rules Moses recited for the people, meaning that either Moses’ memory is faulty or God changed his mind.

I. Thou shalt worship no other god.

II. Thou shalt make thee no molten gods.

III. The feast of unleavened bread thou shalt keep.

IV. Six days thou shalt work, but on the seventh day thou shalt rest.

V. Thou shalt observe the feast of weeks, of the firstfruits of wheat harvest,
and the feast of ingathering at the year’s end.

VI. Thrice in the year shall all your men children appear before the Lord God.

VII. Thou shalt not offer the blood of my sacrifice with leaven.

VIII. Neither shall the sacrifice of the feast of the passover be left unto the morning.

IX. The first of the firstfruits of thy land thou shalt bring unto the house of the LORD thy God.

X. Thou shalt not seethe a kid [ie, a young goat] in his mother’s milk.

Christians and Muslims are Jewish wanna-bees.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Baruch

Quote from: Drich0150 on June 19, 2017, 03:20:59 PM
No I am not a legalist..

And good thing I brought my blaster... though if you think about it luke, the droids, han and obi wan were the instigators in all the cantina's shenanigans.

Yes, Christians are antinomian ... hence going to Hell for eternity, because they are criminals with a get out of jail free card.  As are Muslims (Allah made me do it).
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Baruch

#59
Quote from: Drich0150 on June 19, 2017, 03:27:21 PM
Sooo.... Koine Greek (semi dead language) to modern english translations are wrong... but Koine greek to Aramaic (completely dead language) to Modern english... those are right... Yeah..

You get Aramaic while spoken was a dialect it was not an official language right? didn't have an official text, which is why EVERYTHING in that period was written in the official empirical standard language and not in 100 regional dialects??

That to have text in Aramaic is to have a letter written in creol or enjun in english?

Goyim do not understand Jewish thinking ... they can't.  Just as men can't understand women (or vice versa).  You have to be one to think like/understand one.  Jews who abandon Jewish thinking ... can't either ... they are Jewish Goyim (aka worse than Goyim).  The NT isn't Koine ... that is a pagan view by pagans who have misappropriated Hellenistic Jewish literature for their own nefarious purposes post 135 CE ... it is Judeo-Greek/Yavanic ... as is the Septuagint.  There have been very few genuine Messianic Jews since 135 CE of any kind ... most of the Hellenistic Jewish Messianics were wiped out in 115-117 CE.  Most of the Church Fathers (who are the precursors and creators of Catholicism) are rootless followers of Paul ... like a Chinese guy pretending to be Native American because he attended a pow-wow once.

Just as Ladino is Judeo-Spanish not Spanish and Yiddish is Judeo-German.  A Gentile German can't understand Yiddish, and Spaniard can't understand Ladino.  It is like asking the Pope to understand marriage, he can't without having been married himself!  Only a small part of the Tanakh (OT) is in Aramaic ... but that is what a plausible Jesus would have spoken, not Greek, not Hebrew.  Paul ... he would have Yavanic as his first language (being a Roman citizen in the East), and Aramaic and Hebrew as second languages he got from the Semitic locals and Yeshiva.  He is a plausible historical character, in a way that Jesus isn't.  A really great and tragic rabbi (who wanted coexistence until G-d came and destroyed the world, any day now).  But I don't think he would approve of what Gentiles did to his new religion (one small branch of a larger Messianic Judaism that allowed Gentiles as full members without conversion to Judaism) that he invented.

There were many kinds of Jewish Messianics, mostly non-Hellenistic ... who were wiped out in the Jewish-Roman wars of 66-74 CE and 132-145 CE.  As I pointed out above, the Hellenistic Jewish agitators were wiped out on their own in 115-117 CE.  Most of the surviving Pauline Christians were Gentiles who couldn't spell Bar Mitzvah if they tried.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.