Author Topic: To which extent Trump is free for what he does in politics?  (Read 403 times)

The question is clear.

He was elected by the nation who has feeewill and freedoom in what they think and choose.
Will he administrate just for the interests of the nation or will he be influenced by some people who are at the back plan?

« Last Edit: May 02, 2017, 12:48:37 PM by SoldierofFortune »

Offline Baruch

Re: To which extent Trump is free for what he does in politics?
« Reply #1 on: May 02, 2017, 01:09:49 PM »
Sorry, but I have to parse this ;-)

Is he a teflon President?

Is he governing for the common good, or for an American minority, or for a foreign power?
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Re: To which extent Trump is free for what he does in politics?
« Reply #2 on: May 02, 2017, 02:00:23 PM »
Sorry, but I have to parse this ;-)

Is he a teflon President?

Is he governing for the common good, or for an American minority, or for a foreign power?

America seems like it is the biggest defender and exporter of democracy in the world.
If he defend just the a minority's interestsö then how can we mention about democracy?
The claims he is governinig for a minority is very strong and this idea finds a lot of supporters in the states.

Re: To which extent Trump is free for what he does in politics?
« Reply #3 on: May 02, 2017, 02:37:51 PM »
I'm having difficulty parsing this as well.

I think you're asking to what extent an American President has the ability to just do whatever he/she wants.

It can get pretty complicated but here's the basics:

Presidential powers
* can veto congressional legislation (the President plays a huge role in shaping the legislative agenda)
* appoints Supreme Court justices, appoints top officials for all federal agencies
* conducts military strikes (technically, declaring war requires congressional approval.  But planting a few freedom seeds does not require congressional approval, only congressional notification.  "I accidentally started WWIII.  Here's a text.")
* appoints ambassadors
* negotiates treaties with other nations
* issues executive orders (can be overturned by the Supreme Court)
* issues pardons

If you noticed some glaring problems here, like the ability to get into a quasi-war without congressional approval or the ability to stack the court with Yes men and then have the judiciary rubber-stamp everything you do or the possibility of, oh I dunno, a single party controlling both Congress and the Presidency and gets more or less free reign to do whatever, then congrats, you just figured out America's achilles heel.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2017, 02:41:52 PM by Hydra009 »

Offline Baruch

Re: To which extent Trump is free for what he does in politics?
« Reply #4 on: May 02, 2017, 06:47:20 PM »
A parliamentary system that happens to have a strong single party majority (not Italy) ... is a tyranny too.  The cabinet appointments, the SCOTUS appointments and many others have to be ratified by the Senate.

And being able to wage war, without declaration, even against Americans ... goes back to President Washington, both before and after his first term ...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shays%27_Rebellion

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whiskey_Rebellion

America doesn't defend or export democracy ... it defends and exports itself.  In the last 100 years, the trans-national leadership of the world has grown and grown ... making vast amount during both World Wars ... and the subsequent Cold War (and regional hot wars).  American leaders didn't want to overturn European hegemony from 100 years ago, they desired to first join it, and later lead it.  Russia, China and India continue to resist.  In the 19th century there was the Great Game ... but in the 20th there was The Heartland ...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Geographical_Pivot_of_History
« Last Edit: May 03, 2017, 06:52:32 AM by Baruch »
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Re: To which extent Trump is free for what he does in politics?
« Reply #5 on: May 02, 2017, 07:03:06 PM »


Here's a transcript of the interview:

http://theslot.jezebel.com/donald-trump-is-unintelligible-1794580772


and I thought Sarah Palin was unintelligible!
God Not Found
"I am an expert of electricity. My father occupied the chair of applied electricity at the state prison."
W. C. Fields

Re: To which extent Trump is free for what he does in politics?
« Reply #6 on: May 02, 2017, 07:27:47 PM »
God Not Found
"I am an expert of electricity. My father occupied the chair of applied electricity at the state prison."
W. C. Fields

Re: To which extent Trump is free for what he does in politics?
« Reply #7 on: May 03, 2017, 01:54:07 AM »
I'm having difficulty parsing this as well.

I think you're asking to what extent an American President has the ability to just do whatever he/she wants.

It can get pretty complicated but here's the basics:

Presidential powers
* can veto congressional legislation (the President plays a huge role in shaping the legislative agenda)
* appoints Supreme Court justices, appoints top officials for all federal agencies
* conducts military strikes (technically, declaring war requires congressional approval.  But planting a few freedom seeds does not require congressional approval, only congressional notification.  "I accidentally started WWIII.  Here's a text.")
* appoints ambassadors
* negotiates treaties with other nations
* issues executive orders (can be overturned by the Supreme Court)
* issues pardons

If you noticed some glaring problems here, like the ability to get into a quasi-war without congressional approval or the ability to stack the court with Yes men and then have the judiciary rubber-stamp everything you do or the possibility of, oh I dunno, a single party controlling both Congress and the Presidency and gets more or less free reign to do whatever, then congrats, you just figured out America's achilles heel.

yes and no

the president can start military action without authority from Congress but if it goes badly he can be fully prosecuted for any disastrous situation created. (if Congress gave authority to start with then he can't be prosecuted) The whole concept of the president dreamin up a war and then getting Congress to approve it is ass-backwards. For the U.S. to be involved in a war, the whole idea is supposed to start and end with the Congress.

treaties are supposed to be negotiated with the Senate looking over the predidents shoulder.

There is also no where in the Constitution that says federal judges serve for life (they are allowed to serve during good behavior) meaning Congress can remove them without an inditement.

The Constitution says nothing about executive orders.( Still trying to find the law written by Congress) so they only have any weight in a court room if Congress passed a law that says so.

the president can veto a law, but Congress can go back to the table and override the veto. also any law that the president does not sign or veto within 10 biz days becomes law without his signature.

god is never early, but he is never late either... so true, so true; but I would rather have him show up late than to not show up at all. When was the last time god showed up for anything??? uh never

Re: To which extent Trump is free for what he does in politics?
« Reply #8 on: May 03, 2017, 02:22:36 AM »
True.  My quick-and-dirty version doesn't convey a lot of details.

Offline Baruch

Re: To which extent Trump is free for what he does in politics?
« Reply #9 on: May 03, 2017, 07:06:17 AM »
yes and no

the president can start military action without authority from Congress but if it goes badly he can be fully prosecuted for any disastrous situation created. (if Congress gave authority to start with then he can't be prosecuted) The whole concept of the president dreamin up a war and then getting Congress to approve it is ass-backwards. For the U.S. to be involved in a war, the whole idea is supposed to start and end with the Congress.

treaties are supposed to be negotiated with the Senate looking over the predidents shoulder.

There is also no where in the Constitution that says federal judges serve for life (they are allowed to serve during good behavior) meaning Congress can remove them without an inditement.

The Constitution says nothing about executive orders.( Still trying to find the law written by Congress) so they only have any weight in a court room if Congress passed a law that says so.

the president can veto a law, but Congress can go back to the table and override the veto. also any law that the president does not sign or veto within 10 biz days becomes law without his signature.

War-powers fantasy.  The US has been under executive war powers since 1950 (Korea conflict).  Technically, the US has been at war with N Korea all the way back to 1950.  Under nuclear era conditions, the quaint mechanisms of the Constitution had to be bypassed.  This is why war propaganda about N Korea is essential, to justify the Congressional allowed Executive over-reach ... ratified by later Congressional legislation (cut back because of Nixon but expanded again under 9/11).  It is equally essential for the "permanent war party" to never resolve the Korean conflict.  Other actors (Cuba, N Vietnam, etc) have been sub-villains of this agenda.  The fall of the Soviet Union was a huge negative to the "permanent war party" so it has been necessary to antagonize Russia to create the necessary fear level to justify the military expenditures.

There are lots of things that the Constitution and amendments don't cover.  Often in some amendments the giant loophole is "will be detailed in subsequent legislation".  Research the amendment that allowed the Fed and the Income Tax.  Very little in the actual amendment, but they all knew what wasn't written, when they wrote it.  In actual practice, the President, as part of his CinC powers, has controlled foreign policy and non-treaty agreements.  President Teddy Roosevelt laid the groundwork for the current Korea mess .. no treaty required:

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/06/opinion/06bradley.html

Pay attention to what main-line MSM and scholarship denounce ... you can see the CFR in action ...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Imperial_Cruise
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Online Shiranu

Re: To which extent Trump is free for what he does in politics?
« Reply #10 on: May 03, 2017, 09:26:54 AM »
Quote
He was elected by the nation who has feeewill and freedoom in what they think and choose.

Correction; he was elected by the electoral college, which gives small states too much power over everyone else. The nation voted for Hillary.
"I have decided to stick with love. Hate is too great a burden to bear." - Martin Luther King, Jr.

"You must not lose faith in humanity. Humanity is an ocean; if a few drops of the ocean are dirty, the ocean does not become dirty." - Mahatma Gandi

Re: To which extent Trump is free for what he does in politics?
« Reply #11 on: May 03, 2017, 10:34:03 AM »
Also, "freedom to think" is a questionable term, especially in an election whose hallmark was the rampant use of deliberate misinformation and much of it originating from outside the United States.

Re: To which extent Trump is free for what he does in politics?
« Reply #12 on: May 03, 2017, 10:49:36 AM »
And the notable lack of ability to think clearly casts serious doubt on the integrity of the choice.

Suppose I present two mayoral candidates for an immediate vote.  That vote determines who becomes mayor and who does not.  Then I present purported facts about the candidates - some true, some partially true, some true but misleading, and many complete falsehoods.  The people vote.  Later, to their horror, they find out the hard way that not all was as it appeared.

Should that vote be considered an honest reflection of the people's will?
« Last Edit: May 03, 2017, 10:52:54 AM by Hydra009 »

Re: To which extent Trump is free for what he does in politics?
« Reply #13 on: May 03, 2017, 11:49:09 AM »
In a foul mood....................it seems to me right now, that the populace of this country are too stupid/lazy to want anything other than a despot.  It is akin to being a religious person--give yourself over to a skydaddy dictator--reduces the need to think, and is oh so easy to just take the word of a religious leader.  I see this country jumping from one dictator to another until one of them makes it permanent.
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent,
Is he able but not willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able or willing?
Then why call him god?

Offline Baruch

Re: To which extent Trump is free for what he does in politics?
« Reply #14 on: May 03, 2017, 12:56:26 PM »
Correction; he was elected by the electoral college, which gives small states too much power over everyone else. The nation voted for Hillary.

Give California back to Mexico ... so they can have decent Mexican food there ;-)
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