100 Days and Counting

[Baruch]

Bernie speaks from conviction, not because of ideological necessity but as a moral imperative. He would have disturbed the establishment way too much; that's why he was not allowed to succeed.

On the other hand, beware of demagogues who tell you what you want to hear:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fLJBzhcSWTk

[reasonist]

On the other hand, beware of demagogues who tell you what you want to hear:

Socrates makes a valid point connecting the right to vote with the level of education, but how could that be implemented? Having an IQ test before going into the voting booth? Cutting of a part of the citizenry from having a voice? Socrates doesn't provide a solution either and neither did Epicurius or Lucretius who would be labelled as more Kantian than Socrates. Beyond that I have a hard time remembering much about the subject being out of school for 45 years. Although I agree with that school of thought, no solution to this dilemma of the uneducated/uninformed having voting rights has been proposed to my knowledge. Churchill was right when he said Democracy is the worst form of government except all the others that have been tried. Hegel came closest to the ideal but again only in theory; we all know how Marxism turned out, so what's left??

[Hydra009]

Socrates makes a valid point connecting the right to vote with the level of education, but how could that be implemented? Having an IQ test before going into the voting booth?

We've tried literacy tests in the past.  Shockingly, it didn't lead to a more enlightened electorate.  Quite the opposite, in fact.

Churchill was right when he said Democracy is the worst form of government except all the others that have been tried.

Pretty much.  Previously, I've asked those opposed to democracy to put it to a vote.  I stopped doing that after Turkey's infamous referendum.

[reasonist]

We've tried literacy tests in the past.  Shockingly, it didn't lead to a more enlightened electorate.  Quite the opposite, in fact.
Pretty much.  Previously, I've asked those opposed to democracy to put it to a vote.  I stopped doing that after Turkey's infamous referendum.

That's another issue I cannot understand. How can people give up their freedom voluntarily? Erdogan's job was mostly ceremonial, correct me if I am wrong. Over the last 15 years or so he consolidated power, so his intentions should have been crystal clear, especially after the failed coup. He purged tens of thousands of civil servants, judges, officers etc., and yet voters still gave him a carte blanche in the referendum. I just hope that the EU won't even consider Turkey's membership anymore. Bad enough they are a member of NATO! But then again remember the Junta in Greece, or Franco in Spain, or Salazar in Portugal. NATO was silent about that too. Nothing surprises me anymore.

[Baruch]

Socrates makes a valid point connecting the right to vote with the level of education, but how could that be implemented? Having an IQ test before going into the voting booth? Cutting of a part of the citizenry from having a voice? Socrates doesn't provide a solution either and neither did Epicurius or Lucretius who would be labelled as more Kantian than Socrates. Beyond that I have a hard time remembering much about the subject being out of school for 45 years. Although I agree with that school of thought, no solution to this dilemma of the uneducated/uninformed having voting rights has been proposed to my knowledge. Churchill was right when he said Democracy is the worst form of government except all the others that have been tried. Hegel came closest to the ideal but again only in theory; we all know how Marxism turned out, so what's left??

The only people who think that politics solves their problems, are politicians ;-)  Ape men ... doesn't matter what ideology, what party.  It is poo throwing and lice picking, all the way down.  And no ... Socrates did have a solution, goad the demos into judicially murdering you.  Plato had a different solution ... The Republic ... and that is what we have today, if you were awake.  Plato indicated in The Republics, that the only people who should be allowed to lie, is the government.  And that deliberate narrative control thru religion and false social contract was necessary.  I am sure every national security state operative has memorized it.

[Baruch]

That's another issue I cannot understand. How can people give up their freedom voluntarily? Erdogan's job was mostly ceremonial, correct me if I am wrong. Over the last 15 years or so he consolidated power, so his intentions should have been crystal clear, especially after the failed coup. He purged tens of thousands of civil servants, judges, officers etc., and yet voters still gave him a carte blanche in the referendum. I just hope that the EU won't even consider Turkey's membership anymore. Bad enough they are a member of NATO! But then again remember the Junta in Greece, or Franco in Spain, or Salazar in Portugal. NATO was silent about that too. Nothing surprises me anymore.

A historian ;-)  Young people don't remember the authoritarians in S Europe.  Back then, as long as you were anti-Soviet, you were a good guy.  But it goes back further, to before WWII.  Once Hitler was defeated, NATO needed the Papacy on its side, including the Greek Orthodox Church.  It was precisely those conservative elements that had encouraged fascism in the first place.  Their fascism became our fascism.  Soviet distrust became justifiable homicide for us, but reminds me that even the Soviet Union wasn't always wrong.  We now have the EUSSR and the USSA ... how long will this corruption continue to circle the toilet?

See, you don't understand because you are a nice person, a rational thinker.  You don't know the joys of evil and irrationality.  You need to go on a bender; destroy your job, your family, your life.  Then you will understand the Elite much better.  Or better, become a short story writer, where you have to describe villainy from the inside out.

[Baruch]

A brilliant non-partisan description of the first 100 days ...

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/features/taibbi-the-war-in-the-white-house-w480238

Doesn't make me happy BTW ... even if I didn't vote for Trump.  We would have had similar results with the totally vile Hillary.  We are in late stage Empire.  Ave!  The Pretorian Guard has spoken!  We are all RINO/DINOs now.

[Blackleaf]

A brilliant non-partisan description of the first 100 days ...

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/features/taibbi-the-war-in-the-white-house-w480238

Doesn't make me happy BTW ... even if I didn't vote for Trump.  We would have had similar results with the totally vile Hillary.  We are in late stage Empire.  Ave!  The Pretorian Guard has spoken!  We are all RINO/DINOs now.

I doubt Crooked Hillary would have defunded after school programs and environmental protection agencies, banned Muslim refugees from entering the USA, sent over 50 missiles at a single airbase in Syria and still fail to bring it out of commission, spent hundreds of millions of tax dollars on golfing trips, or damaged our foreign relations as thoroughly as he has. She probably wouldn't have threatened to throw us back into the dark ages of Christian rule either.

[reasonist]

A historian ;-)  Young people don't remember the authoritarians in S Europe.  Back then, as long as you were anti-Soviet, you were a good guy.  But it goes back further, to before WWII.  Once Hitler was defeated, NATO needed the Papacy on its side, including the Greek Orthodox Church.  It was precisely those conservative elements that had encouraged fascism in the first place.  Their fascism became our fascism.  Soviet distrust became justifiable homicide for us, but reminds me that even the Soviet Union wasn't always wrong.  We now have the EUSSR and the USSA ... how long will this corruption continue to circle the toilet?

See, you don't understand because you are a nice person, a rational thinker.  You don't know the joys of evil and irrationality.  You need to go on a bender; destroy your job, your family, your life.  Then you will understand the Elite much better.  Or better, become a short story writer, where you have to describe villainy from the inside out.

Thanks, I think :-)  so you are saying that the next generations can't learn from history or don't want to. The circling continues until another major (nuclear) confrontation? This time it won't be 50 million, it could be all of humanity. Just because some super egos, stone age brains, pissing contest. I remain an optimist, naive maybe, but an optimist.
So then Socrates and Plato did not have viable, rational solutions or proposals either. Murdering your opponents is hardly a sane solution. And the 'Republic' of today isn't working so well. You are lucky to have a constitution, cherish it and adhere to it. Many countries in the first world don't have one or ignore it. Maybe someone should tell Trump.

[reasonist]

A brilliant non-partisan description of the first 100 days ...

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics/features/taibbi-the-war-in-the-white-house-w480238

Doesn't make me happy BTW ... even if I didn't vote for Trump.  We would have had similar results with the totally vile Hillary.  We are in late stage Empire.  Ave!  The Pretorian Guard has spoken!  We are all RINO/DINOs now.

Thank you for sharing. Well written article, sobering and scary to imbibe.

[Baruch]

I doubt Crooked Hillary would have defunded after school programs and environmental protection agencies, banned Muslim refugees from entering the USA, sent over 50 missiles at a single airbase in Syria and still fail to bring it out of commission, spent hundreds of millions of tax dollars on golfing trips, or damaged our foreign relations as thoroughly as he has. She probably wouldn't have threatened to throw us back into the dark ages of Christian rule either.

Lithmus test politics.  As long as we are SJW ... then we can institute cannibalism.  Liberals are being taken to the cleaners by the Caligulas.

[Baruch]

Thanks, I think :-)  so you are saying that the next generations can't learn from history or don't want to. The circling continues until another major (nuclear) confrontation? This time it won't be 50 million, it could be all of humanity. Just because some super egos, stone age brains, pissing contest. I remain an optimist, naive maybe, but an optimist.
So then Socrates and Plato did not have viable, rational solutions or proposals either. Murdering your opponents is hardly a sane solution. And the 'Republic' of today isn't working so well. You are lucky to have a constitution, cherish it and adhere to it. Many countries in the first world don't have one or ignore it. Maybe someone should tell Trump.

The only thing that people learn from history, is that nobody learns from history.  Mostly because they don't try.  My Millenial daughter for instance, only has time for the immediate needs.  And a little escapist entertainment.  Must be typical though.

Sorry ... the odds of survival of a suicidal species is low.  I am only a guarded optimist.  You can only get to me if you get past my weapons systems ;-)  Socrates did what he wanted, he acted as an exemplar, that only a few people cared to emulate.  And we aren't sure that Plato, Xenophon etc were any good at emulating him.  The US Constitution, as I have pointed out has been a dead letter since 1950.  It is observed in the breach, and cherished only when it does things we want.

[Baruch]

Thank you for sharing. Well written article, sobering and scary to imbibe.

Real Politik and Bismarkian sausage making.

[fencerider]

spent hundreds of millions of tax dollars on golfing trips

oh for the love of the monkey, that's how he's gonna make America great again

[Baruch]

oh for the love of the monkey, that's how he's gonna make America great again

Caligula's victims wished he had played more golf ;-)