Author Topic: So we just launched 50 tomahawks at the Syrian Government  (Read 2293 times)

Offline Cavebear

Re: So we just launched 50 tomahawks at the Syrian Government
« Reply #75 on: April 12, 2017, 02:56:20 AM »
His concern about little babies' suffering rings pretty hollow considering his stance towards Syrian war refugees.

If Trump was really concerned, he would accept refugees and help them.  He mainly just had to "show strength".  And a pretty lame response if that was his intent.  The Syrian planes were bombing the populace the next day.

Reports today suggested the Trump attack damaged 20% of the Syrian Air Force.  Why 20%.  100% or nothing.

And if we really want to bother Assad, how about a few right into his bedroom?

Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!  b 1950

Offline SGOS

Re: So we just launched 50 tomahawks at the Syrian Government
« Reply #76 on: April 12, 2017, 08:27:23 AM »
Let me first grant that hindsight is 20/20, but I do sometimes wonder if we might have been better served going for regime change back then, while the Iraqi army was folding like a house of cards and units were surrendering to news crews.
Had we continued, I'm guessing HW would have gotten even more support than his son, probably up near 90% approval compared to the 2/3 that George had for his invasion, making it highly politically correct to invade at that time.  We would have been invading as a consequence of Saddam's highly offensive behavior in Kuwait, and would have something solid to point to as a moral justification.  But lets set aside the value of political correctness and emotional satisfaction and consider practical outcomes.

When GW invaded, Saddam had been beaten into compliance 10 years earlier, and was not posing a threat to even his weakest neighbors.  OK he did pose threats to targeted populations of opposition within Iraq, just as Assad and other Mideast dictators.  But Bush Senior had contained Saddam, not perfectly by any means, but in a way which was highly geopolitically effective, and more productive than the power vacuum and the ensuing chaos left behind by his son.

From a political approval perspective, an invasion by HW would have been more easily justified, but from a practical standpoint, not invading and forced compliance was probably a more effective way of reducing Mideast instability, making the practical outcome more effective than a more emotionally based response to our own moral outrage.

The biggest unknown for me is not knowing if we would be in this clusterfuck today if we had acted differently in either the HW Administration or the GW Administration.  It's easy to say, "This could have been avoided," but no one really knows that.  It might be that our ability to punish and control will never match the inertia of Mideastern culture.

Offline Baruch

Re: So we just launched 50 tomahawks at the Syrian Government
« Reply #77 on: April 12, 2017, 01:14:19 PM »
Don't forget, GHW told the Shites and Kurds to revolt after the armistice in 1991, telling them we would support them.  And then we didn't.  We wanted Saddam to kill the Kurds (anti Turkey) and the Shites (pro Iran).  Moral corruption is a cess pool, the biggest chunks float to the top.  Of course we also told Saddam that we wouldn't intervene in Kuwait, and then did after he thought he understood our "green light".  We were using Saddam against SA, but just to frighten them, not to destroy them.  And no need to destroy Saddam, because he might prove useful later (like his war against Iran, that we helped him with, supplying gas warfare technology).  And we still want to go into a much larger and more populous country (Iran) and Shi'ite all over them.
שלום

Offline Cavebear

Re: So we just launched 50 tomahawks at the Syrian Government
« Reply #78 on: October 11, 2017, 05:06:25 PM »
And what "Shock and Awe" did they have these months later?
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!  b 1950

Offline Draconic Aiur

Re: So we just launched 50 tomahawks at the Syrian Government
« Reply #79 on: October 11, 2017, 06:04:32 PM »

Offline Cavebear

Re: So we just launched 50 tomahawks at the Syrian Government
« Reply #80 on: October 11, 2017, 06:14:04 PM »
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!  b 1950

Offline Baruch

Re: So we just launched 50 tomahawks at the Syrian Government
« Reply #81 on: October 11, 2017, 08:40:42 PM »
And what "Shock and Awe" did they have these months later?

Jeebus!  You keep resurrecting dead strings.  Does Martha and Mary know?
שלום

Offline Cavebear

Re: So we just launched 50 tomahawks at the Syrian Government
« Reply #82 on: October 18, 2017, 04:06:16 AM »
Jeebus!  You keep resurrecting dead strings.  Does Martha and Mary know?

I was bored.  And it seemed something that could stand a bit more discussion...
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!  b 1950

Offline pr126

Re: So we just launched 50 tomahawks at the Syrian Government
« Reply #83 on: October 18, 2017, 04:11:13 AM »
Hi Cavebear, do you have a problem with insomnia?
“True Ignorance is not the absence of knowledge but the refusal to acquire it.” - Karl Popper

Offline Cavebear

Re: So we just launched 50 tomahawks at the Syrian Government
« Reply #84 on: October 18, 2017, 04:23:20 AM »
Hi Cavebear, do you have a problem with insomnia?

No, insomnia works just fine for me.  36 hours up, 14 hours in bed.  The cats hate the schedule though...
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!  b 1950

Offline pr126

Re: So we just launched 50 tomahawks at the Syrian Government
« Reply #85 on: October 18, 2017, 04:25:06 AM »
Well in this case, not worth losing any sleep over it.
“True Ignorance is not the absence of knowledge but the refusal to acquire it.” - Karl Popper

Offline Cavebear

Re: So we just launched 50 tomahawks at the Syrian Government
« Reply #86 on: October 18, 2017, 04:35:26 AM »
Well in this case, not worth losing any sleep over it.

And what are YOU doing up at this hour?  In my case, I really don't live on a 24 hour schedule.  I struggled with time all my life, in college, and the 30 years of my career.  I managed it.  On retirement, free of time-demands, I found my true natural cycle.   36/14.
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!  b 1950

Offline pr126

Re: So we just launched 50 tomahawks at the Syrian Government
« Reply #87 on: October 18, 2017, 04:36:51 AM »
I live in the UK, here it is 09:36 AM.
“True Ignorance is not the absence of knowledge but the refusal to acquire it.” - Karl Popper

Offline Cavebear

Re: So we just launched 50 tomahawks at the Syrian Government
« Reply #88 on: October 18, 2017, 04:44:17 AM »
I live in the UK, here it is 09:36 AM.

Ah.  See, this is the dead time in US ET.  I'm up and awake and everyone else (mostly) is gone to bed.  At it seems normal to me to be awake now.  It is really quite maddening sometimes.
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!  b 1950

Offline pr126

Re: So we just launched 50 tomahawks at the Syrian Government
« Reply #89 on: October 18, 2017, 04:49:08 AM »
And very quiet too.

I am usually up at 4 AM gmt. I too have some sleep problem.
I guess it is to do with age.
“True Ignorance is not the absence of knowledge but the refusal to acquire it.” - Karl Popper