Author Topic: Is a ban on Muslims legal???  (Read 4976 times)

Offline SGOS

Re: Is a ban on Muslims legal???
« Reply #45 on: February 12, 2017, 09:57:46 AM »
Voting is an exercise in self deception and manipulation. 
There is a sense of futility about it.  No matter if the guy I vote for wins or loses, the dynamics behind the outcome seem odd and directed by irrelevant motivators that I usually don't relate to.  If my guy wins, there is a certain satisfaction, but in the end, the satisfaction is usually no more meaningful than when the Boston Celtics beat the Chicago Bulls.  Although it often seems as meaningful as life and death at the time.  The underlying problems that we hope to correct usually remain.  However, there are small victories now and then that ease suffering.  Often times, these have nothing to do with politicians, but with quirks of the constitution interpreted by the court, which I guess is why the politicians want to control the courts.  The damned courts get in the way of political ideology as they interpret constitutional philosophy, which might exist only because of the unintended consequences of the founding fathers.

Are there any constructive ways in politics?  I have told you people ... that you have to stop voting for self destruction.  You need to replace the two old parties entirely ... you need to start that with a powerful third party.  Trump is doing that, if he continues to Center, and marginalize the DNC and RNC.
Trump is a Republican, not a third party.  He was nominated by the right wing (the Republican Party). I kind of understand your position that he is a closet centrist with the interests of the public as his focus.  But I believe that no matter how adamant you are about instructing the rest of us about reality, the idea that Trump has the welfare of the country in mind is probably as wishful as "knowing" a Democrat in the Whitehouse would not be there to help himself first.

You might be right.  It's to early to tell, but with what we actually know about Trump at this time, you would be right entirely by accident.  A positive outcome would be that Trump will rattle the Hell out of the cage that results in a bloodless anarchy, and a reconstruction.  But that's far fetched enough to be insane.  The system will beat him.  He's still just a guy, not a dictator and his influence pales to the power of the two party system as it now exists.  Want to take that bet?  It would be a fun bet.  Say just a dinner, not a bunch of money, because the outcome isn't really that glorious or worth much more than a friendly concession on either of our parts.

We may want to redefine the terms of deciding the bet, because frankly, I don't think you have a snowball's chance of winning under the terms I've defined at this point.

Offline Baruch

Re: Is a ban on Muslims legal???
« Reply #46 on: February 12, 2017, 10:35:14 AM »
Honest self examination is the beginning of wisdom.  There is no understanding without it.  And no, I am no Trump advocate, but I do have a problem with TDS or HDS ... but I did use HDS as a tool against TDS until the inauguration.  As long as the DNC continue to go full retard ... they are dead to me.  The RNC has been full retard for just as long.  The RNC had a chance to escape the Bushes with McCain in 2000, and screwed him in S Carolina primary.  The DNC had a chance to escape the Clintons with Bernie in 2016, and screwed him too.  I say screw both of them.

Yes, not everything is bad.  Gays have at least won a temporary victory.  But it will be temporary, if like African-Americans, they remain house-slaves of the Democrats.  As long as they are "partisan" their gains can be overturned at every election.  And yes, the court system was a wise if annoying part of the three branch system.  So many people believe in Leviathan, by Thomas Hobbes ... we want an absolute monarch, with our without a royal family.  Americans say "l'etat cest moi".

I don't know who is a Republican or a Democrat, they are both sheep dip in wolve's clothing (deliberately said).  The Clintons are Republicans.  Nixon was more of a Democrat than they were, and less corrupt too.  If Trump is Tea Party, if he can castrate the DNC and RNC ... then he is the new FDR, a traitor to his own class.  But will that happen?  I never predict the future, just what is possible, not what is certain.  My tea leaves are silent, my tarot cards remain in their box, my zodiac sign is a sea-goat ... so I say ... baaa humbug.

« Last Edit: February 12, 2017, 10:48:33 AM by Baruch »
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Offline Cavebear

Re: Is a ban on Muslims legal???
« Reply #47 on: February 13, 2017, 05:15:45 AM »
On the OP .. the Republican Congress has reintroduced their bill, defeated several times ... to put the Muslim Brotherhood on the terrorist list.  This is much more serious than a travel ban, since CAIR etc are participants with the Muslim Brotherhood, which is a terrorist organization, outside the US.  All depends on what our Saudi masters order us to do.  Pure politics, since the US government and the Saudi government are both ... terrorist organizations.

Trump should simply sign an Executive Order prohibiting terrorism.  That would solve EVERYTHING! 
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!  b 1950

Offline Baruch

Re: Is a ban on Muslims legal???
« Reply #48 on: February 13, 2017, 07:12:36 AM »
Trump should simply sign an Executive Order prohibiting terrorism.  That would solve EVERYTHING!

Worked for Obama, Bush Jr etc.
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Offline Cavebear

Re: Is a ban on Muslims legal???
« Reply #49 on: February 13, 2017, 07:49:02 AM »
Worked for Obama, Bush Jr etc.

Did it?  Really?  You just say stuff and don't support the statements.  Does that bother you in the least?
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!  b 1950

Offline Baruch

Re: Is a ban on Muslims legal???
« Reply #50 on: February 13, 2017, 12:46:01 PM »
Did it?  Really?  You just say stuff and don't support the statements.  Does that bother you in the least?

Every thread has many subthreads and digressions.  Do try to keep up ;-)
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Offline fencerider (OP)

Re: Is a ban on Muslims legal???
« Reply #51 on: February 14, 2017, 01:36:41 AM »
Trump should simply sign an Executive Order prohibiting terrorism.  That would solve EVERYTHING! 
Yes it would. Cause if he did he would have to resign. He sure is scarin the crap out of me. No more Trump, no more terrorism.- case solved
another quote from an antagonist agnostic: not expecting god to show up, but if he does we’re going to have to beat the prick up.

Offline Cavebear

Re: Is a ban on Muslims legal???
« Reply #52 on: February 15, 2017, 01:20:31 AM »
Yes it would. Cause if he did he would have to resign. He sure is scarin the crap out of me. No more Trump, no more terrorism.- case solved

Right, LOL!
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!  b 1950

Offline pr126

Re: Is a ban on Muslims legal???
« Reply #53 on: February 17, 2017, 12:09:44 AM »
“True Ignorance is not the absence of knowledge but the refusal to acquire it.” - Karl Popper

Offline Sorginak

Re: Is a ban on Muslims legal???
« Reply #54 on: February 17, 2017, 12:16:34 AM »
A ban on Muslims is not illegal, but it might just start the war Trump wants.

Offline Cavebear

Re: Is a ban on Muslims legal???
« Reply #55 on: February 17, 2017, 02:49:30 AM »
A ban on Muslims is not illegal, but it might just start the war Trump wants.

I (reluctantly) suspect it might be legal.  The US Constitution does not generally apply to immigration laws.  Want-to-be immigrants are not citizens.  Immigration rules can be as stupid or intelligent as we want them to be.
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!  b 1950

Offline Baruch

Re: Is a ban on Muslims legal???
« Reply #56 on: February 17, 2017, 05:06:24 AM »
I (reluctantly) suspect it might be legal.  The US Constitution does not generally apply to immigration laws.  Want-to-be immigrants are not citizens.  Immigration rules can be as stupid or intelligent as we want them to be.

This debate was over in the US 1920, when free immigration to the US ended.  The Red Scare, the Black Scare, the Mafia Scare and the KKK put an end to it.  The War on Terrorism is a redo of the old Black Scare.  The new anarchists are even wearing black again.  Ignorance of history means ...
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Offline pr126

Re: Is a ban on Muslims legal???
« Reply #57 on: February 17, 2017, 05:16:11 AM »
A ban on Muslims is not illegal, but it might just start the war Trump wants.
How do you know that Trump wants to start a war ?
With whom?

How many wars has Obama started, supported, financed, provided weapons, and  training?

Who set the middle east on fire? Who removed the rulers in Egypt, Libya, and tried and failed in Syria?
Replaced them with Muslim jihadist, and ISIS?
How many Muslim countries has he bombed?

All for the glory of the Nobel peace prize.

But Trump is to blame? Really?

« Last Edit: February 17, 2017, 05:25:46 AM by pr126 »
“True Ignorance is not the absence of knowledge but the refusal to acquire it.” - Karl Popper

Offline Baruch

Re: Is a ban on Muslims legal???
« Reply #58 on: February 17, 2017, 05:47:02 AM »
How do you know that Trump wants to start a war ?
With whom?

How many wars has Obama started, supported, financed, provided weapons, and  training?

Who set the middle east on fire? Who removed the rulers in Egypt, Libya, and tried and failed in Syria?
Replaced them with Muslim jihadist, and ISIS?
How many Muslim countries has he bombed?

All for the glory of the Nobel peace prize.

But Trump is to blame? Really?

Leftists never "get" irony.
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Offline Cavebear

Re: Is a ban on Muslims legal???
« Reply #59 on: February 17, 2017, 05:48:56 AM »
How do you know that Trump wants to start a war ?
With whom?

How many wars has Obama started, supported, financed, provided weapons, and  training?

Who set the middle east on fire? Who removed the rulers in Egypt, Libya, and tried and failed in Syria?
Replaced them with Muslim jihadist, and ISIS?
How many Muslim countries has he bombed?

All for the glory of the Nobel peace prize.

History shows what Obama did.  What matters now is what Trump will do.  Given his stated intentions before the elections, and his appointments and actions after his election, things do not look good.  When our friends and allies think our President is acting insanely, that isn't a good sign...

But Trump is to blame? Really?
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!  b 1950