News:

Welcome to our site!

Main Menu

There is no God PERIOD

Started by Ro3bert, February 01, 2017, 08:35:37 PM

Previous topic - Next topic

Blackleaf

Quote from: AllPurposeAtheist on February 03, 2017, 12:17:23 PM
Proof? Science?  Since when have we ever relied on these things in this life? The only thing we now need are 'alternative facts' as dictated by our beloved dicktaster in chief..

You mean Lord Dampnut?

"Oh, wearisome condition of humanity,
Born under one law, to another bound;
Vainly begot, and yet forbidden vanity,
Created sick, commanded to be sound."
--Fulke Greville--

Gawdzilla Sama

Quote from: Drew_2017 on February 02, 2017, 11:30:37 PM
I'm just curious if you demand a double blind test for everything you have come to believe is true? Like the belief we owe our existence to unguided naturalistic forces?
I think it's just for the claims regarding something they say created THE WHOLE FUCKING UNIVERSE.
We 'new atheists' have a reputation for being militant, but make no mistake  we didn't start this war. If you want to place blame put it on the the religious zealots who have been poisoning the minds of the  young for a long long time."
PZ Myers

Ro3bert

Quote from: Drew_2017 on February 02, 2017, 11:30:37 PM
I'm just curious if you demand a double blind test for everything you have come to believe is true? Like the belief we owe our existence to unguided naturalistic forces?

No just proof of Gods existence.

Drew_2017

Quote from: Blackleaf on February 02, 2017, 11:42:00 PM
That's not a belief. That is the default position. Everything we can observe is explained by naturalistic forces. Your god, though, has yet to have been proven to have any impact on our universe at all.

We do observe naturalistic forces. We have yet to observe is what caused naturalistic forces to exist and that's the question at hand. What is the naturalistic explanation that explains how naturalistic forces came into existence?
Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one.
Albert Einstein

https://www.dropbox.com/s/jex6k2uvf9aljrq/theism.rtf?dl=0

Cavebear

Quote from: Baruch on February 01, 2017, 08:41:09 PM
Yes, humans are not so great apes.  Meanwhile if a period isn't a divinity, what about a colon?  Would a semi-colon be a demi-god? ;-)

No one uses semi-colons; there is no point to them.
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Baruch

Quote from: Cavebear on February 05, 2017, 01:56:28 PM
No one uses semi-colons; there is no point to them.

Two points actually,  a period and a coma.  Only women worry about the first, the second is a problem for anyone  ;-)
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

aitm

Quote from: Drew_2017 on February 05, 2017, 01:45:14 PM
What is the naturalistic explanation that explains how naturalistic forces came into existence?
Turtles....turtles all the way down.
A humans desire to live is exceeded only by their willingness to die for another. Even god cannot equal this magnificent sacrifice. No god has the right to judge them.-first tenant of the Panotheust

Blackleaf

Quote from: Drew_2017 on February 05, 2017, 01:45:14 PM
We do observe naturalistic forces. We have yet to observe is what caused naturalistic forces to exist and that's the question at hand. What is the naturalistic explanation that explains how naturalistic forces came into existence?

Why should we assume that naturalistic forces did not always exist? You're relying on assumptions.
"Oh, wearisome condition of humanity,
Born under one law, to another bound;
Vainly begot, and yet forbidden vanity,
Created sick, commanded to be sound."
--Fulke Greville--

Shiranu

"A little science distances you from God, but a lot of science brings you nearer to Him." - Louis Pasteur

Drew_2017

Quote from: Blackleaf on February 05, 2017, 05:33:08 PM
Why should we assume that naturalistic forces did not always exist? You're relying on assumptions.

Two main reasons. Big bang theory is still the prevailing theory of how the universe (as we now know it) came into existence. According to that theory the universe emerged from a singularity of infinite mass contained in a single point which would be nothing like the naturalistic forces we know of. The second reason depends on if you believe time always existed without beginning as part of naturalistic forces. If it did, we'd never cross an infinity to get to this time. If you believe time didn't always exist that would be a nature we have no familiarity with.

What's interesting to note is you attempt to get around the inherent weakness of naturalistic forces by imbuing them with supernatural attributes such as always having existed. That is a divine attribute isn't it?

Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one.
Albert Einstein

https://www.dropbox.com/s/jex6k2uvf9aljrq/theism.rtf?dl=0

Drew_2017

Quote from: aitm on February 05, 2017, 04:03:49 PM
Turtles....turtles all the way down.

Sounds more like a declaration of faith. Anything known facts to back up that belief?
Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one.
Albert Einstein

https://www.dropbox.com/s/jex6k2uvf9aljrq/theism.rtf?dl=0

SGOS

#26
Quote from: Drew_2017 on February 06, 2017, 12:36:24 PM
If you believe time didn't always exist that would be a nature we have no familiarity with.  What's interesting to note is you attempt to get around the inherent weakness of naturalistic forces by imbuing them with supernatural attributes such as always having existed. That is a divine attribute isn't it?

I would disagree.  Why is it a divine attribute?

To argue that time, infinity, or beginning is a divine attribute is convenient if one feels compelled to explain time or the absence of time, but explaining that which we don't understand is intellectually futile and intellectually dishonest.

Naturalistic forces may or may not have a weakness.  A weakness as you describe it is little more that not being able to understand something, and it is not an inherent property of the force itself.  This is due to our ignorance.  There is no reason to believe that what we don't understand must be a divine attribute.  All that we can say is that we don't understand.  Any assumptions we can make are speculative, including speculations about divine attributes.   

Blackleaf

^^^What he said. So-called "divine attributes" aren't all that uncommon. Just look at any old white man, and you see a living divine attribute.



There's nothing divine about the sideways eight. Besides, if the universe did have a beginning (and it appears it did), then the natural forces are not eternal anyway. They've always been because they were there from the start. History is likely finite.
"Oh, wearisome condition of humanity,
Born under one law, to another bound;
Vainly begot, and yet forbidden vanity,
Created sick, commanded to be sound."
--Fulke Greville--

fencerider

Quote from: Cavebear on February 05, 2017, 01:56:28 PM
No one uses semi-colons; there is no point to them.
It's a good thing too. Otherwise your gutts would be full of poop.
"Do you believe in god?", is not a proper English sentence. Unless you believe that, "Do you believe in apple?", is a proper English sentence.

Baruch

Quote from: fencerider on February 06, 2017, 11:26:00 PM
It's a good thing too. Otherwise your gutts would be full of poop.

But ...

=0 ... punctuation for colostomy bag ;-(
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.