PSA for Incoming Religious Folks

[Hijiri Byakuren]

This is a message for any theists joining the forum for the express purpose of debating and/or converting atheists on the issue of god(s) existing. If you heed these words, you will have a better time on the site.

#1: We've heard it all before.
Unless you're a theologian, we've read your scriptures more than you have. We know all the arguments that can be made in their favor and have dismissed them. Your take on scripture is neither new nor unique, and if you try to tell us otherwise we will simply laugh at you.

#2: We don't care that much about evolution.
A lot of the self-styled missionaries visiting this forum think they can say "checkmate, atheists!" if they disprove the theory of evolution. This may come as a shock to you, but there were atheists several millenia before evolutionary theory was a thing. It's really not that big of a cornerstone in the worldview of us godless heathens. If you pretend that it is, we will lay the Imperial Smackdown with scientific evidence and rational thought; and then will will laugh at you.

#3: We are not a unified entity.
Atheism/Agnosticism is not a religion. It does not have tenets, there is no doctrine, and we are not especially attached to any sort of sacred writ. There are atheists who are religious (Buddhists, Satanists), there are atheists who identify with a philosophy (skepticism, secular humanism), and even atheists who subscribe to a theistic religion sans deities (Christian Atheists). There are a growing number of atheists, like myself, who don't even identify as atheists because it implies theism as being some sort of default norm. The only thing atheists and agnostics are truly united about is laughing at theists who try to paint them as one big group.

#4: You are not owed anything.
You may ask about our beliefs, and for the most part we are more than happy to explain them to you. However, as we are not trying to impose those beliefs on anyone else, we do not feel the need to fulfill any demands for an explanation. Coming in here with presuppositions and demanding that we answer for them will prompt laughter and taunting.

#5: Don't be surprised if you wind up in Purgatory.
A special forum section called "Purgatory" was created some time ago to act as a soft ban on those who come here to preach. While we do not consider this forum to be a "safe space," the fact of the matter is that this is not ReligiousDebate.com, and most of us are here to get away from your shit. Purgatory is a place where only those interested in conversing with you can see and interact with you, while everyone else goes about their normal business.

#6: Your beliefs aren't entitled to respect.

You might be a devoted religious person whose religion is an integral part of your life and identity and can't imagine living life any other way.  Naturally, you might be aghast at people holding a very different perspective.

Many people, especially many atheists, don't hold a favorable opinion of religion in general, including your religion.  If you're too thin-skinned to handle the occasional "skydaddy" or "holy babble" to say nothing of religious criticism or satire, then you're too thin-skinned to stay here for long.

Also, please don't confuse deference with tolerance.  Tolerance is not freedom from criticism or disapproval.

I'll probably add things to this list as I think of them.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

"You are smarter than all of us, if the set "all of us" contains only fresh mushrooms."

[SGOS]

#2: We don't care that much about evolution.
A lot of the self-styled missionaries visiting this forum think they can say "checkmate, atheists!" if they disprove the theory of evolution. This may come as a shock to you, but there were atheists several millenia before evolutionary theory was a thing. It's really not that big of a cornerstone in the worldview of us godless heathens.

Yeah, it's not really a big issue for us.  It's just something that's there, like the great wall of China.  Monumental?  Sure, but hardly a cornerstone of atheism.  It's just a thing that explains the origins of species.

I think for some theists, evolution gets exaggerated in their psyche, like it's the only threat that could undermine their faith.  I suppose it would be nice for them if evolution were the only thing that turns people into atheists.  That might simplify their problems a bit.  But for all the times a newbe has posed the question, "Why are you an atheist," I can't recall anyone ever replying that it was because of the Theory of Evolution.  Hell, it's not like evolution is the only science project that ever shot holes in the Bible.  Even several alert priests have figured out mechanics of the solar system that turned religious dogma upside down.

It's like if they can destroy evolution, then maybe the whole discipline of science will fall apart, and souls would be safe again, like they were in 1200 AD.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

I think they get the impression that we're all equally scientifically literate and obsessed with using science to prove God doesn't exist.

[Hydra009]

#6: Your beliefs aren't entitled to respect.

You might be a devoted religious person whose religion is an integral part of your life and identity and can't imagine living life any other way.  Naturally, you might be aghast at people holding a very different perspective.

Many people, especially many atheists, don't hold a favorable opinion of religion in general, including your religion.  If you're too thin-skinned to handle the occasional "skydaddy" or "holy babble" to say nothing of religious criticism or satire, then you're too thin-skinned to stay here for long.

Also, please don't confuse deference with tolerance.  Tolerance is not freedom from criticism or disapproval.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Something about bald assertions, please.

[widdershins]

Good thread.  We should do something like this instead of "rules".  How many people have ended up in Purgatory because they thought the place was run by lawyers and the rules were laws they could skirt and argue their way out of?

[Colanth]

Something about bald assertions?  Anyone can make any bald assertion (an assertion with not a shred of evidence to back it up), but a bald assertion doesn't prove the truth of what it asserts, only the lack of knowledge of the person making it.

Good?

[Gawdzilla Sama]

We could have new people post "I've read this" in the thread. Only place they're allowed to post until they do that.

[Hijiri Byakuren]

Something about bald assertions?  Anyone can make any bald assertion (an assertion with not a shred of evidence to back it up), but a bald assertion doesn't prove the truth of what it asserts, only the lack of knowledge of the person making it.

Good?

HOLY SHIT, COLANTH'S BACK!

[Baruch]

Something about bald assertions?  Anyone can make any bald assertion (an assertion with not a shred of evidence to back it up), but a bald assertion doesn't prove the truth of what it asserts, only the lack of knowledge of the person making it.

Good?

So you prefer arguments that get hairy? ;-)

[aitm]

Contrary to your belief, there have  been hundreds of thousands of "gods" prior to yours. The far better reason, and most logical, for your belief in your god, is simply because you were born where you were…pity eh?

[Baruch]

Contrary to your belief, there have  been hundreds of thousands of "gods" prior to yours. The far better reason, and most logical, for your belief in your god, is simply because you were born where you were…pity eh?

I rather agree with the Roman assertion, that there are countless gods ... at least demigods.  The monotheists are so ... mono.

[PickelledEggs]

Good thread.  We should do something like this instead of "rules".  How many people have ended up in Purgatory because they thought the place was run by lawyers and the rules were laws they could skirt and argue their way out of?

I kind of want to do something for new members, if @wolf39us and the other mods think it's a good idea, where it's required to go to the rules page before they can post or make an account or something. This would be a good addition to something like that too, I think. Or at least something close to it.

[PickelledEggs]

Something about bald assertions?  Anyone can make any bald assertion (an assertion with not a shred of evidence to back it up), but a bald assertion doesn't prove the truth of what it asserts, only the lack of knowledge of the person making it.

Good?

Where have you been???