what would be an actually good reason to believe in a god.

[Ananta Shesha]

Holy shit!  You don't need a primer in logical fallacies to see the bullshit in that.

Depends if you were going with the modern bastardize definition or the usage intended at the time of writing which is explicitly stated.

If believers want to go by biblical definition, it explicitly states in Ephesians that faith is a gift of God and not made by man.

If I told you about gold, you may or may not believe. But if I gave you a piece of gold you would have confirmed faith. You will have passed beyond belief and there would be no more room for doubt.

[Sorginak]

The difference being that gold can be shown to exist whereas god cannot. 

[Ananta Shesha]

The difference being that gold can be shown to exist whereas god cannot.

Only God can give you God, man cannot.

Like if someone told me all about you and your personality, I might believe them, I might not. But only when I actually meet you do I know. No one else can accurately represent your unique being.

[Sorginak]

Yet I can be proven to exist whereas god cannot. 

[Ananta Shesha]

Yet I can be proven to exist whereas god cannot.

Can you show me your I?

[Baruch]

Yet I can be proven to exist whereas god cannot.

Only if we meet you in person, not by logic from first principles.  Also if we met you, we would have to see your ID to confirm, and them make sure the ID wasn't fake ... and on down the rabbit hole with Alice.

[Ananta Shesha]

Only if we meet you in person, not by logic from first principles.  Also if we met you, we would have to see your ID to confirm, and them make sure the ID wasn't fake ... and on down the rabbit hole with Alice.

None of that is direct evidence of an "I". Especially not the physical body.

[Baruch]

None of that is direct evidence of an "I". Especially not the physical body.

Materialists believe that their body is "themselves".  Except that the dividing line between the body and the surroundings are arbitrary, if conventional.  Immaterialists believe that they are not localized in space or time.  Both are the ends of a false dichotomy.

[Ananta Shesha]

Materialists believe that their body is "themselves".  Except that the dividing line between the body and the surroundings are arbitrary, if conventional.  Immaterialists believe that they are not localized in space or time.  Both are the ends of a false dichotomy.

I'm localized in space and time...when I feel like it ;)

[Baruch]

I'm localized in space and time...when I feel like it ;)

Exactly, humans have power over human distinctions ... except for people who surrender to lexicographers.

[Ananta Shesha]

Exactly, humans have power over human distinctions ... except for people who surrender to lexicographers.

The distinction is even more pronounced when you get really good at astral projecting nightly, directly from the waking state.

[Mike Cl]

Can you show me your I?

I will show you mine--if you show me yours.  I've made the same offer to god--no luck so far.  But then, god is a fiction--I suspect he/she/it is off playing with Bugs and Taz. 

[Ananta Shesha]

I will show you mine--if you show me yours.  I've made the same offer to god--no luck so far.  But then, god is a fiction--I suspect he/she/it is off playing with Bugs and Taz.

Hah! Touche' pussy cat.

[Baruch]

The distinction is even more pronounced when you get really good at astral projecting nightly, directly from the waking state.

Astral projectors are just voyeurs visiting neighbor babes ... you can tell be cause they wake up after a wet dream ;-)

[Baruch]

Hah! Touche' pussy cat.

Know what is weird?  Taz' dad played golf, sold orange juice, and had the voice of Bing Crosby.  Don't think I ever saw Bugs' father, like his son, he probably took a wrong turn at Albuquerque ;-)