would christians or any other religious people....

[doorknob]

Suffer a blow to their egos when they find out they were wrong? Is that the real reason they cling to some ancient garbage?

You know I was once told that people WANT to believe something naturally but I would argue that they were trained to be that way by their parents. I think deep down many suspect that religion is a farce but cling to it for dear life like their whole world would be shattered. If they only knew how free and enlightening it is to finally shed and reject the stupidity.

[stromboli]

Suffer a blow to their egos when they find out they were wrong? Is that the real reason they cling to some ancient garbage?

You know I was once told that people WANT to believe something naturally but I would argue that they were trained to be that way by their parents. I think deep down many suspect that religion is a farce but cling to it for dear life like their whole world would be shattered. If they only knew how free and enlightening it is to finally shed and reject the stupidity.

In my case no. More like angry from being lied to for so many years. Once you confirm the truth to yourself, you don't get a bruised ego but pissed off.

[GSOgymrat]

I think there are some people, like myself, who are neurologically predisposed to not believing in the supernatural and some people who are predisposed to experiencing sensations associated with supernatural phenomena, which reinforces a belief in spirituality. We know that electrically stimulating certain areas of the brain can produce sensations such as out-of-body experiences, the feeling of there being another presence in the room, feelings of euphoria and a connectedness to other people and natural surroundings, similar to sensations produced by MDMA. I suspect there is probably a continuum of this kind of brain activity and people who naturally have high amounts of that kind of brain activity are more likely to believe in spirits, external locus of control, that life is connected and ecstatic experiences. There are cultures where people take drugs specifically to induce these "spiritual" experiences. Environment and indoctrination play huge role, and provide the narrative for these experiences, but I suspect there are some people who will always feel there is something more than physical reality and some people who will never feel the presence of a spirit or have an ecstatic experience without altering their brains through drugs or other physical interventions. This is just a pet theory, and I could be wrong, but as neuroscience progresses I will not be surprised if we learn that brain function explains some of the spiritual components of religion. Some people may lose their religion but may never completely lose their feelings of spirituality.

Additionally, I know people who would completely fall apart without their faith because it is a primary coping mechanism. Of course they could learn other means of dealing with problems but to just have their faith and social support of their congregation disappear would be a serious blow.

[doorknob]

For me it was a relief. The stress that religion brought me and the dogma bullshit it indoctrinated me with were dragging me down. Once I really start reading about science which I've always loved, I started answering questions I had that religion didn't. Also because science is more reliable than religion it was easy to figure out which one is true and what is false.

But I feel like some people cling to the religion just because they can't be wrong.

[Blackleaf]

In my case no. More like angry from being lied to for so many years. Once you confirm the truth to yourself, you don't get a bruised ego but pissed off.

My reaction was similar. Anger, which continues to build up each day. It seemed like the first 24 years of my life were wasted on going to church, resisting the truth for the sake of faith, praying to a god who never did jack shit to help with issues he already knew about before me asking, and trying to please a god who did nothing to earn my affection to begin with (aside from killing himself to appease himself so he could forgive me for not being 100% perfect according to the impossible standards he set). So much time, energy, and emotions gone to waste for a stupid fantasy. Virtually all of my relationships were formed in church too, which now leaves me with limited suitable company. And now that my mind is free from its grasp, religion continues to screw me over because of my family's convictions, as well as that of American Southwestern society in general. Just fuck Christianity.

[Blackleaf]

For me it was a relief. The stress that religion brought me and the dogma bullshit it indoctrinated me with were dragging me down. Once I really start reading about science which I've always loved, I started answering questions I had that religion didn't. Also because science is more reliable than religion it was easy to figure out which one is true and what is false.

But I feel like some people cling to the religion just because they can't be wrong.

I've found that the ones who were the most certain of their religion were also very certain of themselves in other areas. It's a kind of arrogance that extends from deeply held beliefs to opinions that don't even matter. In their own eyes, they can never be wrong. Ironic, given that they claim to believe that they are "broken" and deserving of Hell. They say one thing, but their behavior speaks louder.

[Solomon Zorn]

I've often wondered what my former minister would do if he found out there's no God, and that he's spent his whole life, teaching a lie.

[Baruch]

Besides the psychological, there is the sociological.  Congregations are a way, in American society, for people to be socialized, in a way that they don't get at home, school, at work or attending political rallies.  Technically, we should be spending 7 days a week at political rallies etc to fulfill our citizenship.  This is why, in ancient Athens, citizenship was only available to free born men, and both whose parents were Athenians.  Only they had the time to deal with the boring endless minutae of civil government ... that was their primary job, what else they did (stone worker, wine maker ...) was their second job.

So yes, people crack up if they loose their relationship with their family, school, work ... or political party ... or congregation.  An unsocialized person is a beast.  It is like a divorce or a death in the family.  And if their primary socialization is with a congregation, then they are hanging by a thread from being a street person or a rioter.

[stromboli]

Besides the psychological, there is the sociological.  Congregations are a way, in American society, for people to be socialized, in a way that they don't get at home, school, at work or attending political rallies.  Technically, we should be spending 7 days a week at political rallies etc to fulfill our citizenship.  This is why, in ancient Athens, citizenship was only available to free born men, and both whose parents were Athenians.  Only they had the time to deal with the boring endless minutae of civil government ... that was their primary job, what else they did (stone worker, wine maker ...) was their second job.

So yes, people crack up if they loose their relationship with their family, school, work ... or political party ... or congregation.  An unsocialized person is a beast.  It is like a divorce or a death in the family.  And if their primary socialization is with a congregation, then they are hanging by a thread from being a street person or a rioter.

^ this. Every church can be considered a social club in terms of including members into a group that meets for reasons other than religion, i.e. "fellowshipping" In the case of more cultish beliefs like JW or Mormons, they can be quite intrusive. As a Mormon you are expected to go to church for 3 hours on Sunday, have family activities on Monday, go to church midweek for programs like Mutual or scouting, do volunteer work that benefits the church with free labor on projects. Very intrusive.

[widdershins]

For me it was fear.  I was TERRIFIED any time I caught myself doubting.  Jesus was coming back ANY MINUTE NOW, when you are least expecting it.  If you're not ready at that EXACT time, you burn in Hell for all eternity.  And how do you make sure you're ready at all times?  Live a perfect, impossible life.

Though it was never stated or directly thought, Jesus was the type of guy who would choose to come back RIGHT when I had just had a doubtful thought and hadn't yet had time to ask for forgiveness.  He did, after all, take a personal interest in me, and I very much feared his wrath.

Doubt was fear.  It could not be tolerated because it would cost me my soul.  I had an eternity of horrible torture awaiting me if I let someone lead me astray.  So fear turned to fury at the person who was talking sense.  HOW DARE this person try to drag me to Hell.  This was a VILE, EVIL, VINDICTIVE person who deserved to burn for all eternity!  That's why, the more sense you talk, the angrier they get with you.  That's why they smile a wicked smile while telling you that you are going to burn in Hell for all eternity.  They're terrified.  Their religion taps into one of the most primal instincts we still have and one which is capable of changing who a person is completely.  A terrified person can do things the rational them never would, and they always do one or both of the same two things: fight or flight, both with a single purpose, survive.  How many times have you talked with a fundamentalist Christian who first gets combative (fight) and then storms off (flight)?  They're angry on the surface, but that anger is just masking a primal fear they have of being cast into Hell (dying).

For less fundamentalist Christians who don't have the "any minute now I'll go to Heaven or Hell, depending on what my soul is like RIGHT THEN" belief, I couldn't tell you.  But for me, there was no pride.  Only constant, unbearable fear which kept me in line.

[Duncle]

Suffer a blow to their egos when they find out they were wrong? Is that the real reason they cling to some ancient garbage?

Hmm...Well, I'd say that there are quite a few different reasons for people clinging to their beliefs, some of which have already been noted by others. One thing to bear in mind is that people are different, and are in different social situations as well, so the factors that lead Person A to cling to religion don't necessarily apply to Person B.
A brief summary of things that lead folk to stick with their outdated fairy-tale beliefs:

1. Simple Ignorance. Many people simply don't know better. They may live in communities where faith is never questioned, and have been taught to think that their religion has all of the important answers. Even in countries like the US and UK, misconceptions about Evolution are extremely common (and of course religionists do their best to keep it that way). If the Theory of Evolution really did say what many creationists claim it says, then I wouldn't believe in it either!
2. Wilful Ignorance. I've (sadly) encountered this quite a few times. Religious people frequently consciously avoid arguments/ ideas that contradict their beliefs- arguments/ideas that they find disconcerting and threatening. Its much easier for them to stick with what they "know".
3. Social Pressure. This can take an extreme form in some jurisdictions, especially Islamic ones where apostasy carries a death penalty. In the US, intolerance of Atheism is widespread, and religion is (utterly falsely) equated with morality. On a micro-level, religious people normally have religious families, so breaking with religion can have serious personal consequences.
4. Fear. Widdershins has covered this one admirably in the post above.
5. Existential Angst. Religion paints a delusionary picture of a Universe created for us, and filled with objective meaning, including an objective moral code which comes from god. Facing the truth- that meaning is created by us humans, and that morality is a social and evolutionary phenomenon- is a tricky thing for many people. The real Universe is a lot colder and scarier (but also more beautiful and awe-inspiring) than the delusionary Universes constructed by religionists.

So theres my list. Probably left important stuff out, which I'll think of later today.

[stromboli]

^ good list. Thanks.

[SGOS]

Suffer a blow to their egos when they find out they were wrong? Is that the real reason they cling to some ancient garbage?

You know I was once told that people WANT to believe something naturally but I would argue that they were trained to be that way by their parents. I think deep down many suspect that religion is a farce but cling to it for dear life like their whole world would be shattered. If they only knew how free and enlightening it is to finally shed and reject the stupidity.

Like Stromboli, that was not the case with me.  I probably experienced less anger, but I'd be lying if I didn't cop to some anger.  The religion dynamic is complicated and can't be explained with a one size fits all explanation.  For myself, from an early age, I was always questioning my religion, looking for a sign, looking for proof.  I can't remember ever trying to defend my belief.  I just wasn't that invested.  I believed because I was supposed to believe, so the part about parental training does fit me.  Not that I didn't want faith.  In fact, I often tried to find a deep faith.  I even checked out a fundamentalist church, because I was impressed with fundamentalist faith.  But while that faith tended to run deep, it was far too looney tunes to take seriously.  So I moved on, thinking a more new age, invent my own god and my own personal spirituality, might suit me better, maybe a spirituality that didn't fly in the face of reality with never ending contradictions.

I didn't reject religion like I do now, I just went along with it, but it just kept getting harder the older I got.  When I finally accepted my atheism, there was no loss of ego, because I wasn't the least bit ego invested in belief or non belief to begin with.  I was just searching for proof.  I just wanted to know.  I was disappointed with the fact that I had to accept that I could not know.  I would have been more satisfied if I ended up knowing something, but I ended up knowing nothing.  But there was also a certain closure in accepting that I knew nothing of God.  Self acceptance has always been a good experience for me; Always.  Fighting it tends to be exhausting.

[doorknob]

I'm just saying I feel that there are some not all christians who are like this. Like Ken Ham who admits that nothing would change his mind is one of these. No matter how much information or evidence you throw at these kinds of people they will never admit it even if they know they are wrong! They are dishonest. Some going as far as making up or twisting information to fit their agenda. I think the main reason is because it would be a blow to their ego.

Some people act like their belief is so fragile that it would shatter their whole world. I also love the people who think that once you become an atheist moral and immoral no longer matter. Yes I'm going to start murdering and stealing all of the sudden just because I stopped believing in god. All my morals just went out the window. These people are incapable of comprehending what happens once you stop believing. Right and wrong doesn't just vanish because there is no god. That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard!

I'm sure we all feel frustrated by these types of people and America is littered with them!














I'm sure we all know this.

[SGOS]

I'm just saying I feel that there are some not all christians who are like this. Like Ken Ham who admits that nothing would change his mind is one of these. No matter how much information or evidence you throw at these kinds of people they will never admit it even if they know they are wrong! They are dishonest. Some going as far as making up or twisting information to fit their agenda. I think the main reason is because it would be a blow to their ego.

No question that there are these kinds of theists.  We have all met them.  They show up in this forum.