Heads up for Catholics that were abused by their Priests! .........

[Mike Cl]

From the Washington Post:

Five myths about the Catholic sexual abuse scandal
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/04/16/AR2010041602026.html


WARNING: You may have to re-think your blatant prejudice after reading the article.

Actually after reading this attempt to explain away the culpability of this Moral, Just and Beautiful institution, I am even more disgusted. 

Here is an example from the exploding the myths of the church atricle:

3.  Sexual abuse is more pervasive in the Catholic Church than in other institutions.

"Sexual abuse of minors is not the province of the Catholic Church alone. About 4 percent of priests committed an act of sexual abuse on a minor between 1950 and 2002, according to a study being conducted by John Jay College of Criminal Justice in New York. That is roughly consistent with data on many similar professions."

Wow! only 4%!!  Hell, that's nothing to get worked up about you guys!  That's not much.  Let's see............how many priests was that (I don't know the exact number for that time frame, but you can look it us and do the math)?  I'm sure the victims sure feel better now.  Is that the total number or just the ones that became public?  I wonder how many were/are hidden?  And this is from an institution that preaches that Jesus is your very own personal god--your savior; he loves you and looks after you.  And keeps you safe so your local priest can play patty cake with you.  And this priest is steeped in the teachings of this morally objective person/god that Jesus is.  He is an expert in this field, so he is intimately familiar with Jesus' teachings.  Yet that did not stop them from not only creating victims of the most vulnerable, but then  lying about it--and the infallible pope covering it up as well.  Yes, these are the actions of a strong follower of the objective morality of Jesus. 

And there we are told that the rate of creating victims is about the same as many similar professions.  I don't think these other professions are really equal in that none of them are steeped in the objective of the teachings of Jesus.  The priest is THE expert in this field and is lead by the infallible pope, so what could go wrong?  And still, with all that preparation, soul searching, praying (preying, actually) and study, the best this wonderful, beautiful, moral institution was to be roughly the same as others.  What the hell is the point of this Institution then, if at it's best, it can only do average work?  Well, what that real work is is fairly easy to see--gain power, maintain power and gather wealth--at that this wonderful, beautiful institution excels!!!!  Hyprocracy--the Crown Jewel in the Pope's Miter! 

[stromboli]

The point being that the Catholic clergy has made a concerted effort to cover up their crimes, misdirect investigations, relocate perpetrators and deny, deny, deny.

[21CIconoclast]

I certainly hope you never admit to anyone that you graduated from high school (assuming you did which is questionable based on your logic).

Or that you placed your own children at risk by sending them to school. You MUST be a homeshooler, right?

And please tell us that none of your tax dollars go to support these schools where predators roam the halls and locker rooms looking for their next victims.

After all, given the disgusting sexual abuse of kids by public school teachers and their willing accomplices, the administrators who hid them, why would you ever admit you were a part of that or subject your own kids to the risk?

Randy,

You debate as a child with your ever so weak circular reasoning and comical red herrings.

YOUR PATHETIC WEAK QUOTES: "I certainly hope you never admit to anyone that you graduated from high school (assuming you did which is questionable based on your logic)." 

Or that you placed your own children at risk by sending them to school. You MUST be a homeshooler, right?

And please tell us that none of your tax dollars go to support these schools where predators roam the halls and locker rooms looking for their next victims.

After all, given the disgusting sexual abuse of kids by public school teachers and their willing accomplices, the administrators who hid them, why would you ever admit you were a part of that or subject your own kids to the risk?"

Randy, you don't have the sense to feel embarrassed over your weak and comical circular reasoning as you assume as a premise the conclusion in which you wish to reach to save face upon the topic at hand rather than address it fully relative to within the church. Then you use red herrings to take the lime light off of you being a member of a church that COVERED UP PEDOPHILE PRIESTS buggering innocent children, going back to RATzinger being the impetus of the coverups in the 1960s! The Catholic fact of priests buggering kids, and their subsequent coverups, will never leave your division of Christianity, no matter how you try in vain to be apart from it!  Disgusting!

Randy, do a visual for us of your pedophile priests, under the name of Yahweh's doctrine, screwing little kids as Yahweh watched in disgust! "For he looks to the ends of the earth and sees everything under the heavens." (Job 28:24)

[Randy Carson]

Actually after reading this attempt to explain away the culpability of this Moral, Just and Beautiful institution, I am even more disgusted. 

Here is an example from the exploding the myths of the church atricle:

3.  Sexual abuse is more pervasive in the Catholic Church than in other institutions.

"Sexual abuse of minors is not the province of the Catholic Church alone. About 4 percent of priests committed an act of sexual abuse on a minor between 1950 and 2002, according to a study being conducted by John Jay College of Criminal Justice in New York. That is roughly consistent with data on many similar professions."

Wow! only 4%!!  Hell, that's nothing to get worked up about you guys!  That's not much.  Let's see............how many priests was that (I don't know the exact number for that time frame, but you can look it us and do the math)?  I'm sure the victims sure feel better now.  Is that the total number or just the ones that became public?  I wonder how many were/are hidden?  And this is from an institution that preaches that Jesus is your very own personal god--your savior; he loves you and looks after you.  And keeps you safe so your local priest can play patty cake with you.  And this priest is steeped in the teachings of this morally objective person/god that Jesus is.  He is an expert in this field, so he is intimately familiar with Jesus' teachings.  Yet that did not stop them from not only creating victims of the most vulnerable, but then  lying about it--and the infallible pope covering it up as well.  Yes, these are the actions of a strong follower of the objective morality of Jesus. 

And there we are told that the rate of creating victims is about the same as many similar professions.  I don't think these other professions are really equal in that none of them are steeped in the objective of the teachings of Jesus.  The priest is THE expert in this field and is lead by the infallible pope, so what could go wrong?  And still, with all that preparation, soul searching, praying (preying, actually) and study, the best this wonderful, beautiful, moral institution was to be roughly the same as others.  What the hell is the point of this Institution then, if at it's best, it can only do average work?  Well, what that real work is is fairly easy to see--gain power, maintain power and gather wealth--at that this wonderful, beautiful institution excels!!!!  Hyprocracy--the Crown Jewel in the Pope's Miter!

Other studies have placed the percentage in the 2-2.5% range. Still bad, but lower than in the population as a whole.

IOW, the average Catholic child is at greater risk of being molested by his teacher or swim coach than by the parish priest.

But that inconvenient fact doesn't fit your narrative, does it?

And by the way, not only do Protestant Churches have THESE problems, but they also face the issues of ADULT homosexuality and heterosexual ADULTERY among their clergy.

So, again, why the selective outrage?

[Randy Carson]

The point being that the Catholic clergy has made a concerted effort to cover up their crimes, misdirect investigations, relocate perpetrators and deny, deny, deny.

As have public school officials, Penn State University, the Boy Scouts of America....

Why the selective outrage?

[21CIconoclast]

Other studies have placed the percentage in the 2-2.5% range. Still bad, but lower than in the population as a whole.

IOW, the average Catholic child is at greater risk of being molested by his teacher or swim coach than by the parish priest.

But that inconvenient fact doesn't fit your narrative, does it?

And by the way, not only do Protestant Churches have THESE problems, but they also face the issues of ADULT homosexuality and heterosexual ADULTERY among their clergy.

So, again, why the selective outrage?

Randy,

Why the selective outrage?! Are you kidding? Because it is done under the auspices of the Catholic Church that allegedly gives a moral foundation to its followers, where innocent children are to be in a safe haven at their church, and that preaches how ungodly an act of pedophilia is and how it should be punished! Can you spell H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-T-I-C-A-L? Sure you can.

"But whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him to have a great millstone fastened around his neck and to be drowned in the depth of the sea." (Matthew 18:6)  Correct me if I am wrong, but has the Catholic Church drown any pedophile priests with millstones around their neck lately? Huh?

Granted, your primitive Yahweh god has a myriad of examples of pedophilia in his Bronze and Iron Age bible, but that is for another discussion. In the meantime, you're to do everything that you can to prevent any further molestations by your priests, or other attendees, in the church that you hang out at, promise?

[Randy Carson]

Randy,

You debate as a child with your ever so weak circular reasoning and comical red herrings.

Then it should be relatively easy for you to dispatch my arguments. Let's see how you do...

YOUR PATHETIC WEAK QUOTES:

"I certainly hope you never admit to anyone that you graduated from high school (assuming you did which is questionable based on your logic)." 

Or that you placed your own children at risk by sending them to school. You MUST be a homeshooler, right?

And please tell us that none of your tax dollars go to support these schools where predators roam the halls and locker rooms looking for their next victims.

After all, given the disgusting sexual abuse of kids by public school teachers and their willing accomplices, the administrators who hid them, why would you ever admit you were a part of that or subject your own kids to the risk?"

Randy, you don't have the sense to feel embarrassed over your weak and comical circular reasoning as you assume as a premise the conclusion in which you wish to reach to save face upon the topic at hand rather than address it fully relative to within the church.

If I have used circular reasoning in this discussion, please quote my posts and PROVE this assertion.

Then you use red herrings to take the lime light off of you being a member of a church that COVERED UP PEDOPHILE PRIESTS buggering innocent children, going back to RATzinger being the impetus of the coverups in the 1960s!

Prove it.

The Washington Post article pointed out that Ratzinger's involvement is a myth. You have cited no evidence for your claim.

The Catholic fact of priests buggering kids, and their subsequent coverups, will never leave your division of Christianity, no matter how you try in vain to be apart from it!  Disgusting!

Perhaps. The Church has endured survived in the past and, sadly, will probably have to do so again in the future.

However, attempting to smear the entire Catholic Church with this scandal is an unthinking and inappropriate response. Do you honestly believe 1.2 billion Catholics are supportive of any of this? If not, then why attempt to besmirch the entire Church because of a few bad individuals? However, those priests and bishops are responsible for their sins.

See, you commit the fallacy of composition - assuming that something true of part of a whole must also be true of the whole.

You have issues with God, and you hate the Catholic Church. I get it.

But, of course, you began this post proclaiming that I was the one with poor logic and reasoning skills.

Randy, do a visual for us of your pedophile priests, under the name of Yahweh's doctrine, screwing little kids as Yahweh watched in disgust! "For he looks to the ends of the earth and sees everything under the heavens." (Job 28:24)

Most of the victims were male and the average age was 12.6 years old. This was not true pedophilia. This was homosexuality.

And the peak year was 1970.

So, while the victims are still coming forward, the tide has turned, and the Church is taking appropriate actions to deal with the problems created when it permitted gay men to enter the priesthood.

[Randy Carson]

Randy,

Why the selective outrage?! Are you kidding? Because it is done under the auspices of the Catholic Church where innocent children are to be in a safe haven, and that preaches how ungodly an act of pedophilia is and how it should be punished! Can you spell H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-T-I-C-A-L? Sure you can.

Are you equally upset about the instances of this occurring in public schools where the kids are supposed to be learning in a safe, nurturing environment?

"But whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him to have a great millstone fastened around his neck and to be drowned in the depth of the sea." (Matthew 18:6)  Correct me if I am wrong, but has the Catholic Church drown any pedophile priests with millstones around their neck lately? Huh?

If we had, wouldn't you atheists be screaming about that? Just today, someone threw Giordano Bruno in my face because he was executed as a heretic in the 1500's.

And you're actually calling Catholic hypocrites because we haven't drowned anyone lately?

Do you have any idea how unhinged you sound?

Granted, your primitive Yahweh god has a myriad of examples of pedophilia in his Bronze and Iron Age bible, but that is for another discussion. In the meantime, you're to do everything that you can to prevent any further molestations by your priests, or other attendees, in the church that you hang out at, promise?

And you will do the same, I hope, to ensure that predators posing as "transgenders" do not molest little girls in their bathrooms and locker rooms at school or at Target.

Promise?

[reasonist]

Randy,

Why the selective outrage?! Are you kidding? Because it is done under the auspices of the Catholic Church that allegedly gives a moral foundation to its followers, where innocent children are to be in a safe haven at their church, and that preaches how ungodly an act of pedophilia is and how it should be punished! Can you spell H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-T-I-C-A-L? Sure you can.

I always hear the comparison of catholic clergy to school teachers, it comes up every time the subject is brought up. Let's dissect that little morsel of un-wisdom.
As mentioned before religious clergy have drummed into us that they are on an errand of god and therefore have the moral superiority to simple mortals. If they claim that status than they should be held to it!!!!
The vast majority of abused never come forward because of shame and humiliation. Even parents covered up the abuse of their children in order not to shake the tree.
Many clergy have had the given 'opportunity' to molest and rape dozens, some hundreds of children because of that AND because the culprits have been covered and moved by the church hirarchy to new parishes where the abuse continued for years.
One can only imagine what the outcry would be if one in 50 teachers would be raping his pupils! (That number is acknowledged by papa Frank). First of all, there would be no hesitation by parents to go after the school board, and secondly there would not be such a cover up. Thirdly, the abusers would face criminal charges, jail time and would never be allowed to teach again. None of these consequences are applied to the vast majority of clergy abusers. A handful of priests went to jail, the conviction rate is roughly 1 in 250. All on the internet.
Last but not least, I don't know anybody who worships, prays and defends school teachers or boards. Only the flock can keep finding lame excuses and comparisons to keep groveling and adoring this death cult.

[Randy Carson]

I always hear the comparison of catholic clergy to school teachers, it comes up every time the subject is brought up.

With good reason.

Let's dissect that little morsel of un-wisdom.

Oh, goodie.

As mentioned before religious clergy have drummed into us that they are on an errand of god and therefore have the moral superiority to simple mortals. If they claim that status than they should be held to it!!!!

Catholic priests may be called by God and doing His work, but that does not make them morally superior to anyone.

Having begun with a false premise, the rest of this can be ignored. However, let's continue.

The vast majority of abused never come forward because of shame and humiliation. Even parents covered up the abuse of their children in order not to shake the tree.

This is undoubtedly true. Of course, it's true of ALL victims and parents of victims of this type of abuse. So, nothing unique to Catholicism in these two sentences.

Many clergy have had the given 'opportunity' to molest and rape dozens, some hundreds of children because of that AND because the culprits have been covered and moved by the church hirarchy to new parishes where the abuse continued for years.

This is true, sadly. It is inexcusable, and the priests and bishops need to be held responsible.

But now we need to ask another question or two. Is it actually a fundamental doctrine of Christianity or Catholicism that young people should be molested and raped? Is this something that the Church wants to encourage? Does it serve some purpose or benefit the Church in any way?

Or was all of this the result of the implementation of an agenda by homosexual priests and bishops?

One can only imagine what the outcry would be if one in 50 teachers would be raping his pupils! (That number is acknowledged by papa Frank).

2%? Wow. The very number that I quoted earlier. But what does the secular media acknowledge? Here's just one example from Newsweek:

PRIESTS COMMIT NO MORE ABUSE THAN OTHER MALES
BY PAT WINGERT ON 4/7/10 AT 8:00 PM
http://www.newsweek.com/priests-commit-no-more-abuse-other-males-70625

First of all, there would be no hesitation by parents to go after the school board, and secondly there would not be such a cover up.

This was last month:

IPS officials accused of hiding sexual abuse allegations
http://www.indystar.com/story/news/education/2016/04/13/did-ips-officials-try-hide-abuse-allegations/82974760/

And another news outlet reported:

Thursday April 1, 2010
Forgotten Study: Abuse in School 100 Times Worse than by Priests
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2484819/posts

"According to Charol Shakeshaft, the researcher of a little-remembered 2004 study prepared for the U.S. Department of Education, 'the physical sexual abuse of students in schools is likely more than 100 times the abuse by priests.'"

Thirdly, the abusers would face criminal charges, jail time and would never be allowed to teach again. None of these consequences are applied to the vast majority of clergy abusers. A handful of priests went to jail, the conviction rate is roughly 1 in 250. All on the internet.

I'm all for jailing anyone who is convicted of committing these crimes.

Last but not least, I don't know anybody who worships, prays and defends school teachers or boards. Only the flock can keep finding lame excuses and comparisons to keep groveling and adoring this death cult.

Heh...yeah, but only angry atheists keep looking at the Catholic Church while ignoring the greater problem in schools, the Boy Scouts, swim teams and their own neighborhoods.

There are far more sexual predators who do not wear a Roman collar than there are Catholic priests.

[21CIconoclast]

Then it should be relatively easy for you to dispatch my arguments. Let's see how you do...

Randy, you don't have the sense to feel embarrassed over your weak and comical circular reasoning as you assume as a premise the conclusion in which you wish to reach to save face upon the topic at hand rather than address it fully relative to within the church.

If I have used circular reasoning in this discussion, please quote my posts and PROVE this assertion.

Prove it.

The Washington Post article pointed out that Ratzinger's involvement is a myth. You have cited no evidence for your claim.

Perhaps. The Church has endured survived in the past and, sadly, will probably have to do so again in the future.

However, attempting to smear the entire Catholic Church with this scandal is an unthinking and inappropriate response. Do you honestly believe 1.2 billion Catholics are supportive of any of this? If not, then why attempt to besmirch the entire Church because of a few bad individuals? However, those priests and bishops are responsible for their sins.

See, you commit the fallacy of composition - assuming that something true of part of a whole must also be true of the whole.

You have issues with God, and you hate the Catholic Church. I get it.

But, of course, you began this post proclaiming that I was the one with poor logic and reasoning skills.

Most of the victims were male and the average age was 12.6 years old. This was not true pedophilia. This was homosexuality.

And the peak year was 1970.

So, while the victims are still coming forward, the tide has turned, and the Church is taking appropriate actions to deal with the problems created when it permitted gay men to enter the priesthood.

Randy,

I’ll just include one example of your circular reasoning which leads to you begging the question.

YOUR QUOTE: “Or that you placed your own children at risk by sending them to school. You MUST be a homeshooler, right?”

Barring the FACT that you spelled “homeshooler” wrong in your post to me, and you question whether I went to High School or not, is priceless.

Circular Reasoning:
(1) You assume that I was a “homeschooler” emphasizing it with a MUST!
(2) Whatever you say is true, in this case, to save face
(3) Therefore I was a “homeschooler”

Randy, I am not here to school you on fallacies, because I take my time to show you and other pseudo-christians in how outwardly hypocritical they are in following a primitive belief system called Christianity. You're no exception to my quest.


YOUR QUOTE: “Prove it. The Washington Post article pointed out that Ratzinger's involvement is a myth. You have cited no evidence for your claim.”

Conversely, you didn’t cite your reference material in opposition other than to give the Washington Post. Cite the actual material from this newspaper. Are you the “pot” or “kettle” today? :)


YOUR QUOTE: “However, attempting to smear the entire Catholic Church with this scandal is an unthinking and inappropriate response. Do you honestly believe 1.2 billion Catholics are supportive of any of this? If not, then why attempt to besmirch the entire Church because of a few bad individuals? However, those priests and bishops are responsible for their sins.”

Wow, I feel so much better now that the buggering priests, that were caught, are responsible for their sins, that just made my day! I hope that the innocent kids that were screwed by your godly priests feel as good as I do about this great news! 

Its easy to continue to smear the Catholic Church because of the fact that not only did they have priests molesting innocent kids, but your ungodly church covered up your pedophile priest problems for years! Barring the fact that your ungodly church has paid out 4 BILLION plus in reparations from the collection plates on Sunday morning!  2+2=4, get it?


YOUR QUOTE: “But, of course, you began this post proclaiming that I was the one with poor logic and reasoning skills.”

Yes, I subjectively proclaimed that your logic is skewed all the way around, pertaining to the questions at hand, and in other areas as well relative to your primitive faith. This goes without question as explicitly shown.


YOUR QUOTE: “Most of the victims were male and the average age was 12.6 years old. This was not true pedophilia. This was homosexuality.”

WHAT???  Anyone under the age of 18 is considered to be child abuse and rape, and in either case, there was a victim! Pedophilia and Homosexuality are two mutually exclusive concepts! Your job now, in trying in vain to squiggle out of your pathetic church harboring pedophiles and their subsequent coverups, is to cite independent peer reviewed facts to your assertions above!

Oh, Randy, you were saved on our discussion about Yahweh and the Great Flood, by turning yourself into another pretzel, because the thread in question has been unfortunately "locked!"  You owe your Yahweh god a thank you in prayer tonight!  But, the FACT remains that within said thread, it was biblically shown that you committed the Unpardonable Sin, sorry.

[Randy Carson]

Randy,

I’ll just include one example of your circular reasoning which leads to you begging the question.

YOUR QUOTE: “Or that you placed your own children at risk by sending them to school. You MUST be a homeshooler, right?”

Barring the FACT that you spelled “homeshooler” wrong in your post to me, and you question whether I went to High School or not, is priceless.

Circular Reasoning:
(1) You assume that I was a “homeschooler” emphasizing it with a MUST!
(2) Whatever you say is true, in this case, to save face
(3) Therefore I was a “homeschooler”

No, you idiot. I was being sarcastic. You're reading waaaaaaaaaaaay too much into that. My point is that anyone who sends their kids to public schools has MORE to be concerned about than the average Catholic parent. So, if you are NOT worried about predators in the school system, you MUST be a homeschooler. Or selectively outraged.

Can you understand the sarcasm, NOW?

Oh, and sorry for the typo. I proof most of my posts, but only when the discussion is meaningful to me.

Randy, I am not here to school you on fallacies, because I take my time to show you and other pseudo-christians in how outwardly hypocritical they are in following a primitive belief system called Christianity. You're no exception to my quest.

Hey, if you think I'm a false Christian, explain how you arrive at this conclusion. (Or did you begin with the end in mind?)

YOUR QUOTE: “Prove it. The Washington Post article pointed out that Ratzinger's involvement is a myth. You have cited no evidence for your claim.”

Conversely, you didn’t cite your reference material in opposition other than to give the Washington Post. Cite the actual material from this newspaper. Are you the “pot” or “kettle” today? :)

So, because I didn't personally research the material which was previously vetted by the Post, I'm the one without supporting material?

YOUR QUOTE: “However, attempting to smear the entire Catholic Church with this scandal is an unthinking and inappropriate response. Do you honestly believe 1.2 billion Catholics are supportive of any of this? If not, then why attempt to besmirch the entire Church because of a few bad individuals? However, those priests and bishops are responsible for their sins.”

Wow, I feel so much better now that the buggering priests, that were caught, are responsible for their sins, that just made my day! I hope that the innocent kids that were screwed by your godly priests feel as good as I do about this great news!

Why is this a problem? Individuals commit sins and crimes...not institutions. And that just pisses you off, doesn't it? Because you hate the Catholic Church and you want to see it disappear. Unfortunately, the entire Church (which is me and a billion other people) are innocent of the things you want to pin on all of us collectively.

Its easy to continue to smear the Catholic Church because of the fact that not only did they have priests molesting innocent kids, but your ungodly church covered up your pedophile priest problems for years! Barring the fact that your ungodly church has paid out 4 BILLION plus in reparations from the collection plates on Sunday morning!  2+2=4, get it?

And here you undermine your own position by admitting that innocent Catholics are willingly paying restitution to the victims of a few sick priests. We are not shirking our responsibility in this regard, we are stepping up to the collection plate and doing what needs to be done.

That sucks, doesn't it? That we are taking responsibility and continuing to remain faithful to God and His Church rather than running away like you have.

YOUR QUOTE: “But, of course, you began this post proclaiming that I was the one with poor logic and reasoning skills.”

Yes, I subjectively proclaimed that your logic is skewed all the way around, pertaining to the questions at hand, and in other areas as well relative to your primitive faith. This goes without question as explicitly shown.

Yeah, I'm the one committing the fallacy of composition...oh, wait...that was you.

YOUR QUOTE: “Most of the victims were male and the average age was 12.6 years old. This was not true pedophilia. This was homosexuality.”

WHAT???  Anyone under the age of 18 is considered to be child abuse and rape, and in either case, there was a victim! Pedophilia and Homosexuality are two mutually exclusive concepts! Your job now, in trying in vain to squiggle out of your pathetic church harboring pedophiles and their subsequent coverups, is to cite independent peer reviewed facts to your assertions above!

If you bother to do any reading (and this is unlikely) you can learn how psychologists distinguish between pedophilia, hebephilia and ephebophilia.

From Wikipedia:
Pedophilia or paedophilia is a psychiatric disorder in which an adult or older adolescent experiences a primary or exclusive sexual attraction to prepubescent children. Although girls typically begin the process of puberty at age 10 or 11, and boys at age 11 or 12, criteria for pedophilia extend the cut-off point for prepubescence to age 13.

Hebephilia is the strong and persistent adult sexual interest in pubescent (early adolescent) individuals, typically ages 11â€"14.

Ephebophilia is the primary or exclusive adult sexual interest in mid-to-late adolescents, generally ages 15 to 19.

IOW, a large portion of the victims were OLDER than the cut-off point for diagnosis of pedophilia. A large number of the victims were young men...not little boys. THAT was homosexuality.

Now, I understand that not everyone is familiar with the terms...it's sad that anyone has to be. But if you're going to make blanket statements against the Catholic Church, try not to look ignorant when doing it, okay?

Oh, Randy, you were saved on our discussion about Yahweh and the Great Flood, by turning yourself into another pretzel, because the thread in question has been unfortunately "locked!"  You owe your Yahweh god a thank you in prayer tonight!  But, the FACT remains that within said thread, it was biblically shown that you committed the Unpardonable Sin, sorry.

Yeah, I saw what you wrote, and I'm glad you mentioned it here because I wanted to point out that you are clearly ignorant of how formal debates are conducted.

First, the two sides agree on what is called the "resolution", and it is a positive statement of the position to be discussed. One side defends the statement (this is called "taking the affirmative") while the other side attacks the position (this is called "taking the negative").

Now, for the purposes of the proposed debate, I offered a resolution that I thought you would like; namely, that God is a moral monster.

I disagree with that statement, and I would have taken the negative and attacked your ridiculous proposition. Proposing a resolution that YOU would like does not mean that I have committed the unpardonable sin. Moreover, that is NOT even what the unpardonable sin is. However, as a truly ignorant former Christian, I do not expect you to know that, either.

Finally, given how poorly you have argued in this thread, I am EXTREMELY happy that I was "saved" from having to endure further exchange with you. You argue like a stay-at-home mom.

But I was prepared to do so with victory in mind.

[reasonist]

"Last but not least, I don't know anybody who worships, prays and defends school teachers or boards. Only the flock can keep finding lame excuses and comparisons to keep groveling and adoring this death cult."

That was the last sentence of my previous post. How prophetic that was...

http://www.americancatholic.org/news/clergysexabuse/johnjaycns.asp
By Agostino Bono
Catholic News Service

WASHINGTON (CNS) -- About 4 percent of U.S. priests ministering from 1950 to 2002 were accused of sex abuse with a minor, according to the first comprehensive national study of the issue.

The pope already reduced that number by 50%. How credible.

During the same time frame there were 109,694 priests, it said.
Sex-abuse related costs totaled $573 million, with $219 million covered by insurance companies, said the study done by the John Jay College of Criminal Justice in New York.

That makes almost 4,400 catholic predators! (acknowledged!)

For the entire 52-year period "the problem was indeed widespread and affected more than 95 percent of the dioceses and approximately 60 percent of religious communities," said the study.

This from a catholic study. Really nothing further to add.

[Randy Carson]

"Last but not least, I don't know anybody who worships, prays and defends school teachers or boards. Only the flock can keep finding lame excuses and comparisons to keep groveling and adoring this death cult."

That was the last sentence of my previous post. How prophetic that was...

http://www.americancatholic.org/news/clergysexabuse/johnjaycns.asp
By Agostino Bono
Catholic News Service

WASHINGTON (CNS) -- About 4 percent of U.S. priests ministering from 1950 to 2002 were accused of sex abuse with a minor, according to the first comprehensive national study of the issue.

The pope already reduced that number by 50%. How credible.

During the same time frame there were 109,694 priests, it said.
Sex-abuse related costs totaled $573 million, with $219 million covered by insurance companies, said the study done by the John Jay College of Criminal Justice in New York.

That makes almost 4,400 catholic predators! (acknowledged!)

For the entire 52-year period "the problem was indeed widespread and affected more than 95 percent of the dioceses and approximately 60 percent of religious communities," said the study.

This from a catholic study. Really nothing further to add.

So, let's review: If the numbers above are accurate, then 105,000 Catholic priests were innocent.

In the US. During that same time period.

Therefore, attempts to smear the entire Catholic Church and all priests because of the actions of a few are driven by prejudice rather than fact.

+++

And one other point that needs to be made: The problems in the Catholic priesthood are the direct result of admitting homosexuals into the seminaries in the 50's and 60's. The Church tried to care for these troubled gay men, and this is the result.

Thankfully, we have learned a valuable lesson, and men are screened more carefully today.

[Baruch]

If the Pope would let most priests marry, like all Orthodox priests are required to do (except the ambitious ones who want to be bishops) ... then this would be much less a problem.

School teachers aren't required to maintain an unmaintainable celibacy.