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Humanities Section => Political/Government General Discussion => Topic started by: Jason Harvestdancer on July 25, 2020, 08:55:12 AM

Title: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Jason Harvestdancer on July 25, 2020, 08:55:12 AM
The current trend (which I neither endorse nor oppose) is to remove any statues or placenames of those connected with slavery or the confederacy.  That does lead to a rather logical conclusion.

GOP Rep Introduced Bill to Ban Democratic Party for Past Support of Slavery (https://www.newsweek.com/gop-rep-introduced-bill-ban-democratic-party-past-support-slavery-1520152)

Quote
On Thursday, Republican Texas Representative Louie Gohmert introduced a House resolution that would ban the Democratic Party and any other groups that have historically supported the Confederacy or slavery in the United States.

"Since people are demanding we rid ourselves of the entities, symbols, and reminders of the repugnant aspects of our past, then the time has come for Democrats to acknowledge their party's loathsome and bigoted past, and consider changing their party name to something that isn't so blatantly and offensively tied to slavery, Jim Crow, discrimination, and the Ku Klux Klan," Gohmert said in a statement.

Maybe he's got bad motives.  I don't care about that part.  I say "if you're going to troll, go big."
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Shiranu on July 25, 2020, 08:58:56 AM
Quote
That does lead to a rather logical conclusion.

We have very different ideas of what "logical" is. I would classify this one more as "fucking retarded", which coincidentally is what I would label Gohmert as.

And I don't mean that in a slang way, I mean Gohmert is actually fucking mentally handicapped and how the fuck Texas has elected him time and time again is beyond me. Even being a step-relative of his is embarrassing.

If this is "logical" then we also need to ban the United States of America. Ban the Constitution. Ban the military because it use to be segregated.

The thing is people aren't asking for things to be banned, they are asking for monument celebrating men who literally fought to no longer be American and to own slaves to be taken down.

Jesus christ, I don't get how that has to be explained.
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on July 25, 2020, 12:40:36 PM
The current trend (which I neither endorse nor oppose) is to remove any statues or placenames of those connected with slavery or the confederacy.  That does lead to a rather logical conclusion.

GOP Rep Introduced Bill to Ban Democratic Party for Past Support of Slavery (https://www.newsweek.com/gop-rep-introduced-bill-ban-democratic-party-past-support-slavery-1520152)

Maybe he's got bad motives.  I don't care about that part.  I say "if you're going to troll, go big."
The Grim Old Party could be dinged for fighting desegregation.
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Baruch on July 25, 2020, 12:45:21 PM
Remove any legacy of the English ...

Смерть Троцкому!
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Baruch on July 25, 2020, 12:46:33 PM
We have very different ideas of what "logical" is. I would classify this one more as "fucking retarded", which coincidentally is what I would label Gohmert as.

And I don't mean that in a slang way, I mean Gohmert is actually fucking mentally handicapped and how the fuck Texas has elected him time and time again is beyond me. Even being a step-relative of his is embarrassing.

If this is "logical" then we also need to ban the United States of America. Ban the Constitution. Ban the military because it use to be segregated.

The thing is people aren't asking for things to be banned, they are asking for monument celebrating men who literally fought to no longer be American and to own slaves to be taken down.

Jesus christ, I don't get how that has to be explained.

Only fair, capture free range Democrats, send them to W African for sale, let them pick cotton for 400 years ;-))
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Baruch on July 25, 2020, 12:47:06 PM
The Grim Old Party could be dinged for fighting desegregation.

Lincoln was a closet Democrat ... and a vampire slayer.

The only good Yankee is a Yankee who strikes out!
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on July 26, 2020, 02:26:31 PM

Jesus christ, I don't get how that has to be explained.

You don't speak Baruchistani.
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Baruch on July 26, 2020, 05:44:06 PM
You don't speak Baruchistani.

He was responding to Jason Harvestdancer.  Please sober up ;-)
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on July 28, 2020, 12:32:01 PM
He was responding to Jason Harvestdancer.  Please sober up ;-)
See?
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Blackleaf on July 28, 2020, 12:36:33 PM
Confederate flags and statues belong in museums, as cautionary tales of our past, NOT on government property. I'm fine with them being on private property though. Makes it easier to find the racist assholes I want to avoid.

As for the Democratic Party, give me a break. Yeah, sure. Let's ban the party that USED to be the racist party favored by the South, rather than the one that is the racist party favored by the South TODAY.
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Baruch on July 28, 2020, 01:15:27 PM
Confederate flags and statues belong in museums, as cautionary tales of our past, NOT on government property. I'm fine with them being on private property though. Makes it easier to find the racist assholes I want to avoid.

As for the Democratic Party, give me a break. Yeah, sure. Let's ban the party that USED to be the racist party favored by the South, rather than the one that is the racist party favored by the South TODAY.

The idea that LBJ, our most evil President, moved the Dems to the liberal side is a myth ... he had to sell out the Blacks to get his legislation passed, his war in Vietnam approved ... by Southern Senators and Reps, who completely controlled the Congress.  The war in Vietnam and the war on poverty were designed to destroy Black families by removing the man of the family.

"These Negroes, they're getting pretty uppity these days and that's a problem for us since they've got something now they never had before, the political pull to back up their uppityness. Now we've got to do something about this, we've got to give them a little something, just enough to quiet them down, not enough to make a difference." - LBJ ... well attributed

"I'll have those n*ggers voting Democratic for 200 years." - LBJ ... less well attributed (Snopes is a Dem operation).

The Dems started to become liberal in 1972, with the McGovern candidacy.  This started the see-saw battle between neo-liberals and hippies in the Dem party.  Jimmy Carter was a Trilateralist, same as the Clintons and the Obamas.  Bernie Sanders isn't even a Democrat, he is an Independent Marxist.  But the Dem party continues to commit suicide by Biden bringing Bernie Bros on-board ... though if Biden is elected, the neo-liberals will betray them, just as they do other minorities.

If you want to remove any legacy of the US ... remove all statues, rename all US military locations after Chinese generals.
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Jason Harvestdancer on August 11, 2020, 10:08:10 PM
I've never bought the whole "the parties switched sides" trope.
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Baruch on August 11, 2020, 11:04:27 PM
I've never bought the whole "the parties switched sides" trope.

All tropes are CIA psyops.  Or we can say, it is more complicated than sloganeering simpletons can handle.

pr126 was quite clear, that the Dems have reverted to their 1860 form, and still using Blacks as an excuse for their treason.
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on August 12, 2020, 10:41:18 AM
I've never bought the whole "the parties switched sides" trope.
Party demographics changed. It's in the books.
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Baruch on August 12, 2020, 12:48:02 PM
Party demographics changed. It's in the books.

Yes, LBJ pandered (lied) to the African-American community, got them to move from Republican to Democrat ... all the while screwing them at home and in Vietnam.  Most evil President of all time.  The African-American community was still fooled 30 years later, when President Clinton ended "welfare as we know it" ... another Southern rattlesnake.  Admittedly George W's fake war in Afghanistan and Iraq are great evils too, but we had no draft, no deliberate targeting of young African-American men.  Obama starting 4 new wars is a record, but American troops were minimized ... but he did create the trillion dollar "college loan" hell (in the context of students unable to declare bankruptcy, since Ford in 1976) by greatly accelerating the availability of those loans.

In the future, since all non-White voters are Dems by default (who's fault is that?) ... and non-White population as a percentage is constantly increasing, a permanent Dem totalitarianism is inevitable, isn't it?
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on August 12, 2020, 04:15:29 PM
And does anyone who has even a little knowledge of history have anything to say?
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Baruch on August 12, 2020, 05:20:54 PM
And does anyone who has even a little knowledge of history have anything to say?

Lincoln was a tyrant.  A tyrant I like, but then I like dictators who suspend Habeus Corpus and make war.  If there were no slaves in the South at all, the North still wanted to tyrannize the South ... John Brown was a psycho New Englander, a religious extremist, not unlike a Jihadi.

"Prof: "The Constitution Is Racist"" ... funny how liberals complained about Southern colleges teaching nonsense years ago
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Cassia on August 13, 2020, 08:11:00 AM
Looking over the misty swamp that abridges our backyard, I'm not gonna go into all the subtle beautiful aspects of Southern life. Too bad Lincoln didn't string up every last wealthy traitor to our country. It should have been a clean slate instead of the passive aggression of confederate statuary, smoldering racism and divisive attitudes. Nevertheless these clever, pissed-off bastards discovered (after all the civil rights legislation was enacted) that corporate America loves republicans and hates labor unions and stole lots of manufacturing to the New South. Talk how we rose again and won the war. With the great migration of permanent snowbirds to particular areas the new "Southern" democrats have things swinging.
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Mike Cl on August 13, 2020, 09:38:54 AM
The real 'legacy' of the confederacy was treason and slavery.  It should return to that.  No statues or monuments, plaques, or any other permanent reminder to the confederate cause should remain outside of museums.  Battlefields and govt. parks with battlefields should remain, but as a reminder that the traitorous confederacy were defeated. 

And I agree that all lands used to support slavery, and all slave owners or those who traded in the slave trade in any way, should have been hung.  The land so used, should have been divided up among the ex-slaves.  A clean sweep should have been done!
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on August 13, 2020, 10:51:11 AM
I did a semester looking at the USN and the interdiction of the slave trade in the decades before the Civil War. Slave importation was illegal after, IIRC, 1818, so any ship bringing slaves from Africa would be halted and the cargo impounded. This could be hundreds of people all of whom were wards of the state until the trial(s) were over and their status as "contraband" was confirmed. At that point they would be given passage back to Africa. However, the state and local agencies holding the slaves didn't have funds to house and feed them. So they got permission to sell some of the slaves to care for the rest. As it was often the case that the process took years to come to a conclusion it was, in some cases, case dismissed because the state no long had any "evidence" to present.

AND when they did get back to Africa they were usually landed near a "factory" (where the "factor", or slave merchant, had his shop set up) and they'd be immediately captured by Africans who may have sold them to the factors the first time around. This lead to the founding of Monrovia.
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Baruch on August 13, 2020, 03:25:07 PM
The real 'legacy' of the confederacy was treason and slavery.  It should return to that.  No statues or monuments, plaques, or any other permanent reminder to the confederate cause should remain outside of museums.  Battlefields and govt. parks with battlefields should remain, but as a reminder that the traitorous confederacy were defeated. 

And I agree that all lands used to support slavery, and all slave owners or those who traded in the slave trade in any way, should have been hung.  The land so used, should have been divided up among the ex-slaves.  A clean sweep should have been done!

The North practiced wage slavery and mass importation of immigrants to suppress wages and prevent labor unions.  Death to the Damn Yankees! ;-)  Oh, and Bostonians were investors in the illegal slave trade (NYC banks were there for money laundering).  All Americans are traitors to GB ... hang them all!  Today D and R export jobs to China for the same reason, being co-conspirators in the enslavement of the Chinese people to a bloodthirsty Communist regime!!  Must serve Han Chinese master race!  Enjoy free Mao jacket and bicycle ;-)  Read Biden's Little Red Book (ghost written by AOC and Bernie)!

I agree on the treason accusation however (relative to US Constitution, that was established by a bloodless coup by Franklin, Washington et al).  This was easily ameliorated by passing a constitutional amendment outlining a legal process for secession (Henry Clay should have got this done).  We still don't have one of those, regardless of what California wants.  Present day Dems think they have washed their hands of this original sin (what about the Native Americans?) because they support gay marriage ;-))  Funny how 18th-19th century slave trade abolishment was pushed by Christians.  Atheists established their gulags in the 20th.

"MONEY FOR NOTHING, AND SHIT FOR FREE- BURLINGTON MAKES "REPARATIONS" TASK FORCE" ... Vermont is such a Yankee shithole

"Seattle mayor appeals recall decision that could see her removed from office" ... lower state court upholds the ability to make recall, mayor appeals to state supreme court.  Remove the Confederate legacy from Portland, Seattle, Chicago and NYC!
Title: Re: Removing any legacy of the confederacy
Post by: Baruch on August 15, 2020, 01:41:49 PM
As to anyone who wants to start a civil war against the Federal government for any reason, including political partisanship, I answer ...

“I have for some days held and controlled every avenue by which the people and garrison of Savannah can be supplied, and I am therefore justified in demanding the surrender of the city…I am prepared to grant liberal terms to the inhabitants and garrison; but should I be forced to resort to assault, or the slower and surer process of starvation, I shall then feel justified in resorting to the harshest measures, and shall make little effort to restrain my army—burning to avenge the national wrong which they attach to Savannah and other large cities which have been so prominent in dragging our country into civil war.”  - General Sherman