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Humanities Section => Political/Government General Discussion => Topic started by: Jason Harvestdancer on July 18, 2020, 04:00:58 PM

Title: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Jason Harvestdancer on July 18, 2020, 04:00:58 PM
Democratic Los Angeles County, very left and progressive, has done something so bad I can barely believe it.

Boy, 16, was given estrogen for behavioral disorder while in L.A. juvenile hall, suit alleges - Los Angeles Time (https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2020-07-15/teenage-boy-was-given-estrogen-developed-breast-tissue-while-in-l-a-county-juvenile-hall-lawsuit-alleges)
Teen boy grew breasts from ‘experimental’ estrogen prescribed in jail, lawsuit says (https://nypost.com/2020/07/17/teen-boy-grew-breasts-from-estrogen-prescribed-in-jail-lawsuit-says/)

Parents, of course, not consulted.  A lawsuit has been filed.

Why was he given estrogen?  To treat Oppositional Defiant Disorder.  He didn't respect authority enough.

He's going to need surgery to treat the gynecomastia that he developed, and I would not be surprised if this involved a lot of therapy to treat the other effects.

This is the first time ever that estrogen was used to treat ODD.  Other doctors say it absolutely isn't a treatment for ODD.

Medical experimentation on inmates is definitely a very fascist thing to do.  On a minor no less.  In the left coast no less.

Oh, and before anyone says it, this XY male assigned at birth CIS individual was not suffering any form of gender dysphoria.

The word "fascist" has been very watered down recently.  It was getting that way before, but in the last 4 years it has come to mean anyone who doesn't subscribe to the woke mob.  But in this case it really does apply in its original form.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Baruch on July 18, 2020, 04:50:55 PM
This was how the British treated Alan Turing.  Was this boy gay?  Feminists want to eliminate all masculinity.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Draconic Aiur on July 19, 2020, 02:02:29 AM
Fascism can left or right, but many would deny that left fascism exists because they are brainwashed into believing it that only right fascism exists.

While I think the media is silent about this (because there is little information) because the story doesn't fit their agenda, I'm skeptical about it. Until I have more information I would be neutral because we dont know enough information to assume it was left wing fascism.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Cassia on July 19, 2020, 07:00:52 AM
I think we should limit the term 'fascism' to represent a dictatorial, ultra right nationalist governance. The word is becoming obliterated.

 If this allegation holds, it is disturbing evidence that feminist ideologists need to examine where they are headed. Demonizing young males does not benefit society.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: SGOS on July 19, 2020, 07:24:13 AM
I don't see a partisan issue here.  This is an act of atrocity, but I see nothing in the OP, other than it happened in LA, that it has anything to do with either party.  Were the quacks that did it, politically motivated?
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: drunkenshoe on July 19, 2020, 08:11:21 AM
You are so full of shit, Jason. The problem here is a 16 yo -or anyone at any age- being subjected to any experiment in the first place, with OR without his and his parents' consent in a fucking prison. Not that the experiment included giving estrogen to a male adolescent. What a deliberate piece of news.

Do you have any idea about the experiments that have been made on prisoners -esp. on nonwhite groups- in the States since 1940s? From injecting cancer cells to chronically ill people, giving syphilis... any kind of disease or LSD, dangerous drugs experiments...etc. The ones made on mentally ill inmates?

Overcrowded, underfunded prisons make very convenient places for these kind of atrocities. And today, as nobody fucking cares or do something, it is actually much easier contrary to the common belief.

This has been a loong standing legitimate topic of discussion in the world. Should prisoners be used in medical experiments?! Guess what? The right and religious wing(s) of any kind in the world largely hold the idea that prisoners should be used in many medical experiments, dangerous and unhealthy jobs, actually if possible, there should be no rights for certain type of criminals at all.

But the problem here seems to be the estrogen, right? I'm so sick of this 'my wife fucked my life' angry white male bullshit. Yeah, it is that simple. You are that simple. This is about estrogen, not the experiment.

How many violent males are there in any kind of prisons in the States who defy any kind of rule, authority? But the agenda of the 'woke mob fascism' found a one 16 year old in a 'very left' LA prison to assert itself, through a procedure that apparently doesn't even have a place in medicine by one doctor, right?

This is the moronic mentality caused American people arrive to this point. You can put yourself in a different place because you vote for 'the third party', you represent the same fucking right wing bullshit.

 
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: drunkenshoe on July 19, 2020, 08:36:45 AM
What ideology? What feminism? What has an illegal, unethical experiment conducted to obtain control in a confined place has to do with any ideology at all? Millions of people are in prisons in the States. Limited space, more and more coming. Not enough space or man power or money or willingness to make it better. And your idea about is that the feminist ideology at work?

Men have been castrated for thousands of years for any kind of violence, sexual or otherwise, while the percentage of a certain disorder of the sort is 2-3 % at most in any given population. This is the same idea.   

You know what's the fascism in action here? Almost everybody who reads that piece of news feels they need to pin that onto some common demonised group to recieve approval of their own. The fact that you feel the need to percieve this event in this way and express it so is the smooth, consentual fascism itself at work. Manufacturing consent.

Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Baruch on July 19, 2020, 09:03:25 AM
Notice, nobody posting here was present as a witness.  Are we enjoying our news porn?
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Rogue on July 19, 2020, 10:24:24 AM
Democratic Los Angeles County, very left and progressive, has done something so bad I can barely believe it.

Boy, 16, was given estrogen for behavioral disorder while in L.A. juvenile hall, suit alleges - Los Angeles Time (https://www.latimes.com/california/story/2020-07-15/teenage-boy-was-given-estrogen-developed-breast-tissue-while-in-l-a-county-juvenile-hall-lawsuit-alleges)
Teen boy grew breasts from ‘experimental’ estrogen prescribed in jail, lawsuit says (https://nypost.com/2020/07/17/teen-boy-grew-breasts-from-estrogen-prescribed-in-jail-lawsuit-says/)

Parents, of course, not consulted.  A lawsuit has been filed.

Why was he given estrogen?  To treat Oppositional Defiant Disorder.  He didn't respect authority enough.

He's going to need surgery to treat the gynecomastia that he developed, and I would not be surprised if this involved a lot of therapy to treat the other effects.

This is the first time ever that estrogen was used to treat ODD.  Other doctors say it absolutely isn't a treatment for ODD.

Medical experimentation on inmates is definitely a very fascist thing to do.  On a minor no less.  In the left coast no less.

Oh, and before anyone says it, this XY male assigned at birth CIS individual was not suffering any form of gender dysphoria.

The word "fascist" has been very watered down recently.  It was getting that way before, but in the last 4 years it has come to mean anyone who doesn't subscribe to the woke mob.  But in this case it really does apply in its original form.

I am shocked at your lack of skepticism here. 1. The article made no mention of a possible gender dysphoria issue. 2. We did not hear from Dr. Wang. 3. He has worked at this facility for a long time without incident.

The doctor could be protecting a transgender person from a father that will not be supportive and possibly abusive. Although I'm quite sure he would know the boy would grow breasts. In a boy's juvenile detention center is maybe not the best place to transition. A hormone blocker would have been too obvious though as far as a gender dysphoria issue.

Innocent until proven guilty.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Jason Harvestdancer on July 19, 2020, 10:34:14 AM
This has been a loong standing legitimate topic of discussion in the world. Should prisoners be used in medical experiments?! Guess what? The right and religious wing(s) of any kind in the world largely hold the idea that prisoners should be used in many medical experiments, dangerous and unhealthy jobs, actually if possible, there should be no rights for certain type of criminals at all.

And yet this happened in Los Angeles.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Baruch on July 19, 2020, 10:53:51 AM
And yet this happened in Los Angeles.

It would never happen in an R-mayor city, right?
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: drunkenshoe on July 19, 2020, 11:36:58 AM
And yet this happened in Los Angeles.

And? Your lack of perspective on the general politics of your country; the politics of basic administration, control, the state of prisons; administration of a prison in general terms and the policies enforced (not endorsed); basic means of control of a crowd in a confined place...etc. is alarming. By that I mean, simple basic reasoning when given the information in OP piece. It seems most of the Americans are interested in the subject when the words 'estrogen' or 'transgender' are pronounced. 

Besides that...the 'very left', Jason? That translated as central right in politically correct terms in Obama's period. Now, there is no idea what is really going on. Like the very third party.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Hydra009 on July 19, 2020, 12:36:34 PM
And yet this happened in Los Angeles.
You know, just because something bad happened in LA, doesn't mean the evil libs are committing a fascism.  So far, you have shown what may be a single case of medical malpractice and called it liberal fascism.  Leaps in logic, much?
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Hydra009 on July 19, 2020, 12:40:05 PM
When I first saw this thread, I thought it would be about secret police or the concentration camp thing or the rise of nationalism or the "ethnostate" stuff.  lol, nope.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on July 19, 2020, 02:50:49 PM
Nah,  just bumpersticker politics.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Rosycheeked_rebel on July 19, 2020, 04:59:20 PM
NULL
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Hydra009 on July 19, 2020, 05:26:46 PM
“Fascist” is a lot like “racist” these days; people use them in inappropriate, and honestly just wrong, contexts all the time. This waters down the meanings of these words and true power they hold. When they’re just thrown around all over the place, things that really fit these descriptions aren’t taken as seriously and what once was a very clear picture of what they stood to mean or represent becomes murky. And it’s not good for things like that to be murky or “up for debate”, there is a whole legacy and many historical contexts behind them that we’re now given permission to ignore or minimize.
Yep, and the worst part about that is that the the first people who claim these terms don't mean anything are actual racists who use this wolf-crying behavior as some sort of defense for their own behavior.  "'Racist' doesn't mean anything.  You guys call everybody you don't like racists!"  Well, if you're wearing a white hood and say you say some racist stuff, then it's probably a fairly accurate label, regardless of its general misuse.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Baruch on July 19, 2020, 05:56:43 PM
But you people love Newspeak.  Trump is double-plus un-good!
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Sal1981 on July 19, 2020, 07:19:35 PM
But you people love Newspeak.  Trump is double-plus un-good!
O rly?

I'm of the conviction that if you can't explain something in simple terms, you don't understand it in complex terms.


The word "fascist" has been very watered down recently.  It was getting that way before, but in the last 4 years it has come to mean anyone who doesn't subscribe to the woke mob.  But in this case it really does apply in its original form.
It has always meant to mean authoritarian fucks who want to control other people's behavior and limiting their freedom. What has happened in the U.S. is that the fascists, knowing that their reprehensible excuse of an ideology - which used to be underground - has been given a boost by Trump & Co., they've grown more confident in espousing their idiocy. It used to be that they dog whistled their moronic beliefs in an attempt to affect people, who had no convictions either way, to agree with their authoritarian takes. But now the fascists have pretty much dropped their facade and are out in the open.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Baruch on July 19, 2020, 07:53:20 PM
All liberals have brains like giant headed bald aliens, aieee .

Narcissism by any other name, is just as stinky ;-0

I hope all liberals (nobody here of course) gets disappeared like the not-so-funny comedian in V For Vengeance (sarc).
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Draconic Aiur on July 20, 2020, 02:31:00 AM
I think we should limit the term 'fascism' to represent a dictatorial, ultra right nationalist governance. The word is becoming obliterated.

I call BS. Fascism can occur with every political idea, but history of today marks the word "conservative or right winged", because people are either blind or ignorant of actual history. Look at the history of communism and national socialists, especially in Russia, South America, and Africa.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Shiranu on July 20, 2020, 03:28:35 AM
The prison industrial complex does some fucked up shit, congrats on finally realizing that.

I call BS. Fascism can occur with every political idea, but history of today marks the word "conservative or right winged", because people are either blind or ignorant of actual history. Look at the history of communism and national socialists, especially in Russia, South America, and Africa.

Fascism by definition is right-wing, ultra-nationalistic authoritarianism. At the VERY best your boogieman left is only one of those; they are logically not right-wing and they are certainly not nationalistic. I wouldn't call the "far left" authoritarianism either, since you require authority to actually be one... but if they had power, I'm sure some of them would be.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Draconic Aiur on July 20, 2020, 06:01:54 AM
The prison industrial complex does some fucked up shit, congrats on finally realizing that.

Fascism by definition is right-wing, ultra-nationalistic authoritarianism. At the VERY best your boogieman left is only one of those; they are logically not right-wing and they are certainly not nationalistic. I wouldn't call the "far left" authoritarianism either, since you require authority to actually be one... but if they had power, I'm sure some of them would be.


Did you get that definition from Wikipedia?

Here's a definition not by Wikipedia:

Definition of fascism:
 A political philosophy, movement, or regime (such as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fascism

Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on July 20, 2020, 06:16:29 AM
Linguistic shift.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Shiranu on July 20, 2020, 06:27:33 AM
Did you get that definition from Wikipedia?

Here's a definition not by Wikipedia:

Definition of fascism:
 A political philosophy, movement, or regime (such as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/fascism



They still wouldn't fall under fascists by that definition. Authoritarian, sure, but not fascist.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Baruch on July 20, 2020, 09:08:54 AM
The prison industrial complex does some fucked up shit, congrats on finally realizing that.

Fascism by definition is right-wing, ultra-nationalistic authoritarianism. At the VERY best your boogieman left is only one of those; they are logically not right-wing and they are certainly not nationalistic. I wouldn't call the "far left" authoritarianism either, since you require authority to actually be one... but if they had power, I'm sure some of them would be.

Hitler did nothing wrong.  You are Nazi phobic.  Please report to HR for reeducation.  Example ,,, China vs Uighers.

Anarchists don't have authority, the Left isn't anarchist, they are Left authoritarian.  See Stalin.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Baruch on July 20, 2020, 09:10:04 AM
Linguistic shift.

Newspeak.  Dem = good, Rep = bad
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Baruch on July 20, 2020, 09:11:36 AM
They still wouldn't fall under fascists by that definition. Authoritarian, sure, but not fascist.

I don't mind if an authoritarian like Mao murders me, only if Hitler does it … bwahah

Being half Germanic myself, I am deeply offended by the Germanophobia here, German dictators aren't worse than the other kinds, given a dictatorship is acceptable.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Mike Cl on July 20, 2020, 09:13:22 AM
I call BS. Fascism can occur with every political idea, but history of today marks the word "conservative or right winged", because people are either blind or ignorant of actual history. Look at the history of communism and national socialists, especially in Russia, South America, and Africa.
Making statements like this proves to me you are a piss-poor historian.  Most of what you are alluding to are dictatorships, and they come in all sizes, shapes and colors and flavors.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Baruch on July 20, 2020, 09:14:38 AM
Making statements like this proves to me you are a piss-poor historian.  Most of what you are alluding to are dictatorships, and they come in all sizes, shapes and colors and flavors.

You hate Southern dictators but love Northern dictators.  Davis vs Lincoln.

I have come to like dictators and despise democracy ;-(
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Mike Cl on July 20, 2020, 10:53:12 AM
https://www.slideshare.net/ajdredla/the-8-types-of-government1

 The 8 types of government[1]
1. The 8 Types of GovernmenT
2. The 8 Types of GovernmenT Democracy monarchy republicanism ToTaliTarianism fascism DicTaTorship communism oliGarchy
3. Democracy The word democracy comes from ancient Greek words meaning ‘people’ and ‘rule of government’. It is a system of governmentof a country whose leaders have been elected by the people. When the elected representatives meet in parliament to make laws, the form ofgovernment is a parliamentary democracy.
4. monarchy A monarchy is a form of government led by anindividual who holds the position for life, having inherited the position, and who passes it on to a relative, usually a son or daughter.  In the past, all monarchs held great power andmade all of the decisions and laws of the country.This is known as absolute monarchy. Today most monarchs act as Head of State, filling a ceremonial role with little or no power regarding the actual governing of the country.A constitutional monarchy is a country which has a written Constitution that sets out the rules for how the country will be governed and the rights and responsibilities of its people, and has a
5. republicanismA republic is a country whose head of government is anelected or chosen president. Sometimes the president isalso the Head of State, for example the President of the United States. Presidents are usually elected for aspecific length of time. This is called a ‘term of office’. In some countries a president may only serve a particular number of terms. A republic may or may not be democratic. In a democratic republic, the people choose their leaders through elections, although in countries where thepresident is a ceremonial role, it may be by government appointment rather than by election. In some undemocratic republics the leaders are chosenby a small number of people and may stay in office fora long time, sometimes without ever being elected or re-
6. ToTaliTarianism In a totalitarian society, the government holds absolute control over all aspects of the lives of its people. A set of beliefs is imposed onthe people, who have to conform or face unpleasant consequences. This formof government came into being in the 1920s when the Fascist governmentsof Italy and Nazi Germany came into power.
7. fascism Fascism is a form of government usually headedby a dictator. It involves total government control of political, economic, cultural, religious and social activities. Some industries may be owned by individuals, but under government control. This form of government includes extreme patriotism, warlike policies and extreme discrimination against minority groups.
8. DicTaTorship In a dictatorship, one person, called a Dictator, has absolute power. This differs from totalitarianism in that it is lesscontrolling and not marked by a rigid set of beliefs. Sometimes a country run bydictatorship may be called a republic. Suchrepublics have only one political party and the Dictator makes most government policies and decisions.
9. communismCommunism is an economic system in which there is little or no private ownership - property is heldby the community rather than by individuals. Alleconomic activity is controlled by the government, including things like what crops are grown, what goods are manufactured, and to whom they are sold and at what prices. The decisions made by Communist governments are those that are normally made by private individuals in non- Communist countries. Communist governments are usually a form of totalitarianism, and traditionally allow onlyapproved candidates to stand for election and there is usually little or no choice of candidates at an election.
10. oliGarchy An oligarchy is a form of government inwhich only a few wealthy people hold power. A republic may be an oligarchy if just a few people have the right to vote. Anexample of this was the time of apartheid inSouth Africa. In most oligarchies, the power of the leadership is supported by the wealthy and the military.


Even this is simplistic--but Draconic this gives you an idea of the flavors of govt.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Mike Cl on July 20, 2020, 10:56:22 AM
Does this not fit the orange monster to a T???

fascism: Fascism is a form of government usually headed-by a dictator. It involves total government control of political, economic, cultural, religious and social activities. Some industries may be owned by individuals, but under government control. This form of government includes extreme patriotism, warlike policies and extreme discrimination against minority groups.

This is what he is aiming for.  He is even giving bigly hints that he may or may not accept the results of 2020 election.  If he can get his secret police operating as he hopes he can, he will be willing to start a civil war to become a fascist dictator.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Unbeliever on July 20, 2020, 12:55:56 PM
When I first saw this thread, I thought it would be about secret police or the concentration camp thing or the rise of nationalism or the "ethnostate" stuff.  lol, nope.
I think it's called a hasty generalization.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Draconic Aiur on July 20, 2020, 03:58:51 PM
Talking to a wall.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Shiranu on July 20, 2020, 04:52:16 PM
You're right about that, but not in the way I think you think you are.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Mike Cl on July 20, 2020, 05:11:34 PM
Talking to a wall.
What?  Talking to you--yeah, most of the time is seems to feel like that.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Baruch on July 20, 2020, 08:27:13 PM
I think it's called a hasty generalization.

Better than a generalization while under hallucinogens, right?
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Baruch on July 20, 2020, 08:27:58 PM
Talking to a wall.

Keeps all the illegal Dem voters out ;-)
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Baruch on July 20, 2020, 08:29:47 PM
"Biden, at Muslim voters summit, says ‘I wish we taught more in our schools about the Islamic faith’" … ban teaching Christianity, bring in Islam and pussy hats … this is what you druggies are voting for

"2020 Election Shaping Up To Be Most Litigated In US History; Over 150 Cases Already Filed" … hence time for the military, and line the civilians up for the firing squad

"Words mean whatever I say they mean" … Humpty Dumpty.  This character was based on a murdered English landlord (in Ireland).  Guess the peasants weren't impressed by his Oxbridge education.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Jason Harvestdancer on August 11, 2020, 10:18:27 PM
It has always meant to mean authoritarian fucks who want to control other people's behavior and limiting their freedom. What has happened in the U.S. is that the fascists, knowing that their reprehensible excuse of an ideology - which used to be underground - has been given a boost by Trump & Co., they've grown more confident in espousing their idiocy. It used to be that they dog whistled their moronic beliefs in an attempt to affect people, who had no convictions either way, to agree with their authoritarian takes. But now the fascists have pretty much dropped their facade and are out in the open.

This doctor was operating out in the open giving estrogen to inmates as an experimental treatment for ODD.  I don't see how he got a boost from Trump though.
Title: Re: Fascism in action in Los Angeles County
Post by: Baruch on August 11, 2020, 11:03:00 PM
This doctor was operating out in the open giving estrogen to inmates as an experimental treatment for ODD.  I don't see how he got a boost from Trump though.

Dems are saints, Repubs are devils.  Trump is Mephistopheles ... right hand man of the Devil himself.  See, these post-Christian atheists are closet Jesuits.  They see a secular devil everywhere.  I agree, but I am sufficiently self aware to remain a theist.