Hi all,
I was very surprised to discover that only 10% of the Nobel prize winners are atheist:
1. https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Religion_of_Nobel_Prize_winners.png (https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Religion_of_Nobel_Prize_winners.png)
2. https://emilkirkegaard.dk/en/?p=7237 (https://emilkirkegaard.dk/en/?p=7237)
3. https://www.quora.com/What-proportion-of-Nobel-prize-winners-are-atheist (https://www.quora.com/What-proportion-of-Nobel-prize-winners-are-atheist)
4. https://www.johnlennox.org/resources/145/how-many-nobel-prize-winners (https://www.johnlennox.org/resources/145/how-many-nobel-prize-winners)
This info contradicts everything I've heard before, that there is a strong negative correlation between intelligence and religiosity.
For example:
1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xvILvxYbFA&feature=youtu.be&&t=1m45s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xvILvxYbFA&feature=youtu.be&&t=1m45s)
2. https://www.ted.com/talks/richard_dawkins_militant_atheism#t-955695 (https://www.ted.com/talks/richard_dawkins_militant_atheism#t-955695)
3. https://www.psypost.org/2019/11/meta-analysis-of-83-studies-produces-very-strong-evidence-for-a-negative-relationship-between-intelligence-and-religiosity-54897 (https://www.psypost.org/2019/11/meta-analysis-of-83-studies-produces-very-strong-evidence-for-a-negative-relationship-between-intelligence-and-religiosity-54897)
How do you explain this?
Argumentum ad Populum.
Quote from: Sal1981 on January 18, 2020, 09:44:02 AM
Argumentum ad Populum.
Why do you think that it's an argumentum ad Populum?
Do you think that these articles lies?
Look, Daniel. I don't want to spend the time playing your little game. If you have a point, make it. It's your idea or point, so you spend the time setting it up. You do the work. If not, then just get off your soap box and leave.
What ever the point is, it doesn't change my lack of belief in a god. My lack of belief is based on my personal experience, intelligent or not, popular or not, representative of some potential special peer group or not.
Quote from: Daniel Wilson on January 18, 2020, 10:19:16 AM
Why do you think that it's an argumentum ad Populum?
Do you think that these articles lies?
Because you're using popularity as a measurement stick.
Quote from: Mike Cl on January 18, 2020, 11:28:00 AM
Look, Daniel. I don't want to spend the time playing your little game. If you have a point, make it. It's your idea or point, so you spend the time setting it up. You do the work. If not, then just get off your soap box and leave.
Man, why are you so negative? I gave my point in the first message.
Read it, or leave.
Quote from: Daniel Wilson on January 18, 2020, 12:38:27 PM
Man, why are you so negative? I gave my point in the first message.
Read it, or leave.
You said--'how do you explain it?'. That's backward--how do you explain it. My thought is that you are a theist trolling an atheist site. If not, my bad--but who are you and why are you here??
Quote from: Mike Cl on January 18, 2020, 12:51:07 PM
You said--'how do you explain it?'. That's backward--how do you explain it. My thought is that you are a theist trolling an atheist site. If not, my bad--but who are you and why are you here??
I'm here to get an answer for my question, is that so hard to understand?
Well, Daniel, we don't know where you've heard that "there is a strong negative correlation between intelligence and religiosity." You didn't hear it here, so why do you believe that we know the answer?
Quote from: Daniel Wilson on January 18, 2020, 12:56:06 PM
I'm here to get an answer for my question, is that so hard to understand?
I understand fully--you are simply a theist trolling an atheist site.
Prove me wrong.
Quote from: Unbeliever on January 18, 2020, 01:23:44 PM
Well, Daniel, we don't know where you've heard that "there is a strong negative correlation between intelligence and religiosity." You didn't hear it here, so why do you believe that we know the answer?
Here you go:
https://www.psypost.org/2019/11/meta-analysis-of-83-studies-produces-very-strong-evidence-for-a-negative-relationship-between-intelligence-and-religiosity-54897
OK, but that still doesn't tell me why you believe we know the answer to your question. We're just plain folks, and not cognitive researchers. I'm sure I don't know the answer, but maybe someone here does. Baruch seems to know everything, so maybe we'll hear from him.
Quote from: Daniel Wilson on January 18, 2020, 09:37:28 AM
Hi all,
I was very surprised to discover that only 10% of the Nobel prize winners are atheist:
1. https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Religion_of_Nobel_Prize_winners.png (https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Religion_of_Nobel_Prize_winners.png)
2. https://emilkirkegaard.dk/en/?p=7237 (https://emilkirkegaard.dk/en/?p=7237)
3. https://www.quora.com/What-proportion-of-Nobel-prize-winners-are-atheist (https://www.quora.com/What-proportion-of-Nobel-prize-winners-are-atheist)
4. https://www.johnlennox.org/resources/145/how-many-nobel-prize-winners (https://www.johnlennox.org/resources/145/how-many-nobel-prize-winners)
This info contradicts everything I've heard before, that there is a strong negative correlation between intelligence and religiosity.
For example:
1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xvILvxYbFA&feature=youtu.be&&t=1m45s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xvILvxYbFA&feature=youtu.be&&t=1m45s)
2. https://www.ted.com/talks/richard_dawkins_militant_atheism#t-955695 (https://www.ted.com/talks/richard_dawkins_militant_atheism#t-955695)
3. https://www.psypost.org/2019/11/meta-analysis-of-83-studies-produces-very-strong-evidence-for-a-negative-relationship-between-intelligence-and-religiosity-54897 (https://www.psypost.org/2019/11/meta-analysis-of-83-studies-produces-very-strong-evidence-for-a-negative-relationship-between-intelligence-and-religiosity-54897)
How do you explain this?
From just trying to understand you I lost brain cells, troll.
Sorry Daniel, as a theist I have to give you thumbs down. You simply like to go into a bar in a bad neighborhood and spit in their faces.
Most recent scientists are agnostic or atheist. There is a reason for that (they are overly rational).
I don't ask person X, who has no expertise in Y ... about Y. I find an expert in Y.
Well, as a well known scientific expert, I can tell you that indeed almost all if not all atheists are far smarter than theists. So there you have it from a well known scientific expert.
Quote from: Baruch on January 18, 2020, 04:07:18 PM
Sorry Daniel, as a theist I have to give you thumbs down. You simply like to go into a bar in a bad neighborhood and spit in their faces.
Most recent scientists are agnostic or atheist. There is a reason for that (they are overly rational).
I don't ask person X, who has no expertise in Y ... about Y. I find an expert in Y.
I thought that this is an Atheists Forum.
What "everyone knows" is often incorrect.
Quote from: Daniel Wilson on January 18, 2020, 06:12:16 PM
But I don't understand, this should be an "Atheist Forum", I thought that people will be happy to read researches showing that atheists are much smarter then religious people.
So where am I wrong?
Everyone knows that it's true.
I don't have anything in common with other atheists other than a lack of belief in the supernatural.
Just like only for you only thing you have in common with any other human is that you're breathing, so it is with from atheist to atheist.
Atheism isn't some special club with set rules and ideologies. It is merely the lack of belief in the supernatural, and that is the only thing in common.
I suspect that the average person who doesn't believe in Santa Claus is smarter than the average person who does believe in Santa Claus. But I've never done a scientifically controlled study, so I can't be sure.
Quote from: Unbeliever on January 18, 2020, 06:23:41 PM
I've never done a scientifically controlled study, so I can't be sure.
But other people did just that:
https://www.psypost.org/2019/11/meta-analysis-of-83-studies-produces-very-strong-evidence-for-a-negative-relationship-between-intelligence-and-religiosity-54897
So what?
That's just a statistical correlation.
Here's another:
https://churchoftheflyingspaghettimonsteraustralia.files.wordpress.com/2013/12/pchart1.jpg
Quote from: Sal1981 on January 18, 2020, 06:46:32 PM
So what?
That's just a statistical correlation.
Here's another:
https://churchoftheflyingspaghettimonsteraustralia.files.wordpress.com/2013/12/pchart1.jpg
That's a bad example, it's not the same at all.
Well, duh.
You still have not told us who you are (you are actually supposed to intro yourself and make 10 posts prior to starting a new thread)--so, an intro would be nice.
Quote from: Mike Cl on January 18, 2020, 07:48:02 PM
You still have not told us who you are (you are actually supposed to intro yourself and make 10 posts prior to starting a new thread)--so, an intro would be nice.
I feel it's a shame the intro page won't stop anyone posting elsewhere before they have made 10 there.
Quote from: aitm on January 18, 2020, 04:37:32 PM
Well, as a well known scientific expert, I can tell you that indeed almost all if not all atheists are far smarter than theists. So there you have it from a well known scientific expert.
Speaking to OP?
Quote from: Unbeliever on January 18, 2020, 06:23:41 PM
I suspect that the average person who doesn't believe in Santa Claus is smarter than the average person who does believe in Santa Claus. But I've never done a scientifically controlled study, so I can't be sure.
Coal in your stocking, forever ;-)
Quote from: Baruch on January 18, 2020, 11:00:30 PM
Coal in your stocking, forever ;-)
That increases the chances of diamonds
Quote from: Munch on January 18, 2020, 11:01:11 PM
That increases the chances of diamonds
Only if you have buns of steel, and keep your coal lumps there ;-)
Quote from: Mike Cl on January 18, 2020, 07:48:02 PM
You still have not told us who you are (you are actually supposed to intro yourself and make 10 posts prior to starting a new thread)--so, an intro would be nice.
I don't understand why do I have to introduce myself (10 posts? Is this a Job interview?) before I can ask a simple question, I never saw that in other forums, what kind of game is this?
I came here to ask a question about something that was interested me, do I have to tell you about my personal life in order to do that? Sorry I don't understand that.
Quote from: Daniel Wilson on January 19, 2020, 09:45:32 AM
I don't understand why do I have to introduce myself (10 posts? Is this a Job interview?) before I can ask a simple question, I never saw that in other forums, what kind of game is this?
I came here to ask a question about something that was interested me, do I have to tell you about my personal life in order to do that? Sorry I don't understand that.
I don't care that the rules of this forum chap your lips or that other forums have different rules. The rules were not created by me or for me, but by the people who run this forum. Ask them why they made those rules.
BTW, why are you so hesitant about introducing yourself and making the point of your post clear? do you want to have an intelligent conversation or play a game of 'gotcha'?
Quote from: Mike Cl on January 19, 2020, 09:58:43 AM
I don't care that the rules of this forum chap your lips or that other forums have different rules. The rules were not created by me or for me, but by the people who run this forum. Ask them why they made those rules.
BTW, why are you so hesitant about introducing yourself and making the point of your post clear? do you want to have an intelligent conversation or play a game of 'gotcha'?
You didn't create the rules but it looks like it's very bothering you. I asked a simple question, introducing myself or my beliefs have nothing to do with that. I don't understand how is it relevant or how will it help you answering my question.
Quote from: Daniel Wilson on January 19, 2020, 10:32:41 AM
You didn't create the rules but it looks like it's very bothering you. I asked a simple question, introducing myself or my beliefs have nothing to do with that. I don't understand how is it relevant or how will it help you answering my question.
for a troll, it would be a problem I guess.
Quote from: Mike Cl on January 19, 2020, 11:16:59 AM
for a troll, it would be a problem I guess.
Asking a question about atheism in an atheism forum is trolling? Are you listening to the nonsense that you are talking?
Quote from: Daniel Wilson on January 19, 2020, 11:52:04 AM
Asking a question about atheism in an atheism forum is trolling? Are you listening to the nonsense that you are talking?
I am not talking, I am writing. And I've simply asked you to follow the rules. Trolls hate that. I regard your question somewhat the same way I regard this question--Have you stopped beating your wife yet?
On a fair note we need a public chat so we can filter.
If we don't filter we may falter?
Quote from: Unbeliever on January 19, 2020, 05:27:19 PM
If we don't filter we may falter?
Hey all the spammers, trolls, and zealots will post there.
Not to mention we will get more people. Chatting is swag.
Quote from: Draconic Aiur on January 19, 2020, 07:58:57 PM
Hey all the spammers, trolls, and zealots will post there.
Not to mention we will get more people. Chatting is swag.
Twitter for Atheists?
Twitter's for twits.
Quote from: Draconic Aiur on January 19, 2020, 01:33:02 PM
On a fair note we need a public chat so we can filter.
We filter. I've probably rejected 20 spammers over the past week. I'll admit I let the troll in though.
Quote from: PopeyesPappy on January 19, 2020, 09:13:55 PM
We filter. I've probably rejected 20 spammers over the past week. I'll admit I let the troll in though.
Beat yourself with overcooked ramen ...
Quote from: Baruch on January 19, 2020, 08:23:46 PM
Twitter for Atheists?
It was like the old Atheist site that died when Obscured by Clouds profile died.
Quote from: Daniel Wilson on January 18, 2020, 09:37:28 AMHow do you explain this?
1. Our opinion concerning the existence of deities is in the minority.
2. A lot of people who fit the definition of an atheist don't identify as one. Reasons include avoiding the baggage associated the the term, having a different understanding of the term's meaning, or subscribing to a belief such as humanism which they prefer to use as a label.
Take Neil deGrasse Tyson for example. He has talked about his opinions concerning religion, and in my opinion he sounds like an atheist. He prefers to call himself agnostic. Tyson is far from alone in that regard, so point #2 is probably the best answer to your question.
First of all, it's per capita that matters, not raw statistics. If the number of people dying from AIDS is growing, but the number per capita is going down, that's an improvement. So the real question isn't "do atheists earn more Nobel Peace Prizes than theists," but is, "is the percentage of Nobel Prize winners who are atheists higher than the percentage of people who are atheists?"
Second, using Nobel Peace Prizes as a measurement for intelligence is dubius at best. It sounds like you're trying to find something, anything, that will support your position. If you want to compare intelligence levels, you use an instrument that was specifically designed to do that.
And FYI, I don't think that theists are necessarily dumber. However, it is a fact people with higher levels of education are more likely to be atheists than the general population.
You know, with only about 7% of the world atheist, depending how you count, current day.
Added with the fact that the Nobelprize was created like 120 years ago, meaning even less % of the population has been atheist, on average, during the entire run... Added with any shunning to outspoken godless-men certainly early in the 1900's , and, I suspecte a favoritism in the 'nobel prize for peace' to go to religious figures like the dalai lama... Added with any people who might not be a theist but who feighn it, like hypothetically Obama, in order to procure a certain stature or job... Added yet again with the fact that neither 'liturature' nor 'peace' are what you and I might call 'scientific'...
That all makes me feel like this is not something anyone needs to explain.
Honestly, if anything we should wonder how the hell we even managed to score as high as 10% to begin with.
Quote from: Mr.Obvious on January 21, 2020, 05:53:00 AM
You know, with only about 7% of the world atheist, depending how you count, current day.
Added with the fact that the Nobelprize was created like 120 years ago, meaning even less % of the population has been atheist, on average, during the entire run... Added with any shunning to outspoken godless-men certainly early in the 1900's , and, I suspecte a favoritism in the 'nobel prize for peace' to go to religious figures like the dalai lama... Added with any people who might not be a theist but who feighn it, like hypothetically Obama, in order to procure a certain stature or job... Added yet again with the fact that neither 'liturature' nor 'peace' are what you and I might call 'scientific'...
That all makes me feel like this is not something anyone needs to explain.
Honestly, if anything we should wonder how the hell we even managed to score as high as 10% to begin with.
Well, look at it this way; We are still doing better than the Nazis.
Quote from: SGOS on January 22, 2020, 07:58:16 AM
Well, look at it this way; We are still doing better than the Nazis.
Or Stalinists (see Lysenko).
Quote from: SGOS on January 22, 2020, 07:58:16 AM
Well, look at it this way; We are still doing better than the Nazis.
Oh come on, don't put down the nazis. What did they ever do to deserve that?
This comment brought to you by Mr.Obvious brand sarcasm.
Obvious Sarcasm tm, the sarcasm that's obvious.
Yeah, after all, they kept the trains running on schedule.
Quote from: Unbeliever on January 22, 2020, 04:17:03 PM
Yeah, after all, they kept the trains running on schedule.
Not only on schedule, but often.
Quote from: Daniel Wilson on January 18, 2020, 09:37:28 AM
Hi all,
I was very surprised to discover that only 10% of the Nobel prize winners are atheist:
1. https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Religion_of_Nobel_Prize_winners.png (https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Religion_of_Nobel_Prize_winners.png)
2. https://emilkirkegaard.dk/en/?p=7237 (https://emilkirkegaard.dk/en/?p=7237)
3. https://www.quora.com/What-proportion-of-Nobel-prize-winners-are-atheist (https://www.quora.com/What-proportion-of-Nobel-prize-winners-are-atheist)
4. https://www.johnlennox.org/resources/145/how-many-nobel-prize-winners (https://www.johnlennox.org/resources/145/how-many-nobel-prize-winners)
This info contradicts everything I've heard before, that there is a strong negative correlation between intelligence and religiosity.
For example:
1. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xvILvxYbFA&feature=youtu.be&&t=1m45s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5xvILvxYbFA&feature=youtu.be&&t=1m45s)
2. https://www.ted.com/talks/richard_dawkins_militant_atheism#t-955695 (https://www.ted.com/talks/richard_dawkins_militant_atheism#t-955695)
3. https://www.psypost.org/2019/11/meta-analysis-of-83-studies-produces-very-strong-evidence-for-a-negative-relationship-between-intelligence-and-religiosity-54897 (https://www.psypost.org/2019/11/meta-analysis-of-83-studies-produces-very-strong-evidence-for-a-negative-relationship-between-intelligence-and-religiosity-54897)
How do you explain this?
Poor Spamiel, desperate, so desperate.
So, this same guy posted the same crap on other atheist forums.
On atheistforum.org, he changed his name from Daniel Wilson, to 'I'm a believer now'.
So, just another dishonest theist. What a shock.
Surprise, surprise...
Faith is Doublethink, which means intelligence does not come into religion.
Quote from: Gregory on February 27, 2020, 08:31:21 PM
Faith is Doublethink, which means intelligence does not come into religion.
Correct. CIA never goes to church ... they would never get out of confession.
Yeah, kind of like some people they put in Gitmo.
We only use 10% of our brains, so what does that tell us?
Quote from: Gregory on March 06, 2020, 02:41:15 AM
We only use 10% of our brains, so what does that tell us?
Math is hard.
Quote from: Gregory on March 06, 2020, 02:41:15 AM
We only use 10% of our brains, so what does that tell us?
Which 10% do we use? You think you could get along just fine if you excised 90% of your brain?
Quote from: Unbeliever on March 06, 2020, 01:53:59 PM
Which 10% do we use? You think you could get along just fine if you excised 90% of your brain?
I always wondered. Did scientists come up with that, or was it philosophers?
Quote from: Gregory on March 06, 2020, 02:41:15 AM
We only use 10% of our brains, so what does that tell us?
It tells me you get your information from folklore and urban myths.
Quote from: SGOS on March 06, 2020, 02:42:00 PM
I always wondered. Did scientists come up with that, or was it philosophers?
I'm pretty sure it was neither.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ten_percent_of_the_brain_myth
I'm so fucking tired of seeing that myth. Evolution does not favor such wasted energy. If we really only used 10% of our brains, natural selection would weed out the other 90%. Even Teen Titans Go, a show I hate for devolving a great show into a brainless collection of fart jokes, got this right... I hate praising that show, but it's the ONLY media I've seen that educates the public on the truth about this myth.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AoUE35uUfqg
The Sci Fi movie, Lucy, with Scarlett Johansson is fun but it kind of carries the fiction in science fiction to an extreme. Here's Morgan Freeman in the movie lecturing a bunch of grad students on what is possible with 20%, 40%, 60% brain access.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=567KlA26EwY
Here's Lucy realizing some of her new powers, but it's only the beginning.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m-Zk_lMQVdE
It's a fun flick, but you have to push the envelope on your ability to suspend reality.
Only Democrats, and Chinese communists, are brainiacs.
As around 10% of the world's population is atheist: this sounds correct. One thing that I do know for a fact is that far less than 1% of the prison population in any given country is atheist. Atheists are not only morally superior, they are intellectually superior as well. Observations of the dumb bums who call themselves religious convinces me of this.
Quote from: Gregory on March 16, 2020, 02:44:06 AM
As around 10% of the world's population is atheist: this sounds correct. One thing that I do know for a fact is that far less than 1% of the prison population in any given country is atheist. Atheists are not only morally superior, they are intellectually superior as well. Observations of the dumb bums who call themselves religious convinces me of this.
Hasn't convinced me. But sophisticates do think they are special.
Quote from: Gregory on March 16, 2020, 02:44:06 AM
As around 10% of the world's population is atheist: this sounds correct. One thing that I do know for a fact is that far less than 1% of the prison population in any given country is atheist. Atheists are not only morally superior, they are intellectually superior as well. Observations of the dumb bums who call themselves religious convinces me of this.
To be fair, in countries like America, many prisoners quickly 'find religion', as it pretty much helps your case when you plead for early release.
As such, these numbers seem askew and can not be trusted to be a true representation of the situation.
Quote from: Mr.Obvious on March 16, 2020, 07:16:06 AM
To be fair, in countries like America, many prisoners quickly 'find religion', as it pretty much helps your case when you plead for early release.
As such, these numbers seem askew and can not be trusted to be a true representation of the situation.
I think it's more that prisoners are desperate. They're at the lowest point of their lives, so they turn to God to help them. Also, most of the people who "find religion" in prison were already theists. They just started paying more attention to it. Christians always treat these people like they're new converts, when they've actually always been Christian.
Quote from: Blackleaf on March 16, 2020, 01:01:56 PM
I think it's more that prisoners are desperate. They're at the lowest point of their lives, so they turn to God to help them. Also, most of the people who "find religion" in prison were already theists. They just started paying more attention to it. Christians always treat these people like they're new converts, when they've actually always been Christian.
Well. I'm not going to make a stand over this point. To be honest, I mainly got this from either Bill maher's religulous or an episode of Penn and tellers 'bullshit'. But i heard many pretended to be really religious and play that out as they hoped it would help in their appeal to early release. After all, a religious judge may think 'how good can this guy really be aspiring to become. He' s an atheist, he doesn't believe in anything and is bound for a sin full life on a highway to hell. '
Not exact words, but you get the idea.
But I do think many were indeed already' lowkey christian'
Penn & Teller, if they were prisoners might not be as depressed as the other prisoners. They might be able to use their magic abilities to escape ;-)