https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/21/politics/alabama-megachurch-police-force-trnd/index.html
QuoteAn Alabama megachurch plans to start its own police force thanks to a new law permitting the church to do just that.
The law, signed by Gov. Kay Ivey, authorizes Briarwood Presbyterian to "appoint and employ one or more suitable persons to act as police officers to protect the property of the school or academy."
A similar bill was proposed four years ago, but it was dropped by the Alabama legislature amid a public outcry over the Presbyterian Church in America's racist history, as well as criticism that the bill was unconstitutional and violated the Establishment Clause's separation of church and state. Briarwood Presbyterian is part of the PCA.
Briarwood Presbyterian's congregation is overwhelmingly white. Nearby Birmingham is two-thirds black.
The PCA is a conservative denomination that originated early 1970s Alabama. In 2016 it apologized for "racial sins" that included "the segregation of worshipers by race" as well as "the participation in and defense of white supremacist organizations," among other things.
Officials at Briarwood Presbyterian Church say that a police force is necessary in order to adequately protect its 4,100 members, including 2,000 students and faculty on its two campuses.
The church hopes its new security force will keep intruders and prevent trespassers from accessing the property, it said in a press release that was posted by CNN affiliate WBRC.
The officers will complete state certified training by the Peace Officers Standards and Training Commission. The officers will also be trained on the proper use of a non-lethal weapon.
The ACLU of Alabama tweeted the new law undermines the separation of church and state are is "a threat to our freedom of religion and a violation of the Establishment Clause."
"We expect this law to be challenged in the courts," it said.
The new law is expected to go into effect in the fall.
The beginning of the end of the Bill of Rights! Fucking idiots!
"BuT sHaRiA lAw Is CoMiNg To GeT uS!!!" - Republican Alabamans, probably
I lived in Alabama as a small child, and then we left. It's never been the same since.
Quote from: Unbeliever on June 22, 2019, 08:05:48 PM
I lived in Alabama as a small child, and then we left. It's never been the same since.
I lived in Alabama as a child as well. The best thing, by faaaarrrrrr---was leaving it! got so tired of seeing those 'colored' and 'white' signs everywhere.
Be an interesting experiment. Makes me think of this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjjPlEW9bRM
Not uncommon. Megachurches commonly have official or unofficial police forces, run by off-duty police or elders.
No, not Sharia law. Trying to make Christians into Jihadis? Really? How about atheist legal systems (China etc).
Quote from: Baruch on June 22, 2019, 10:41:11 PM
Not uncommon. Megachurches commonly have official or unofficial police forces, run by off-duty police or elders.
Maybe not uncommon, but it does seem unconstitutional.
Quote from: Mr.Obvious on June 23, 2019, 01:58:00 AM
Maybe not uncommon, but it does seem unconstitutional.
In Belgium. EU constitution, or is there a Belgian one?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/2950276.stm
In the US we have powers delegated to states, to counties, to municipalities. And anything else is reserved for the people. EU people are subjects, not citizens. Of course by-laws by some church, can't overrule higher authority. Not municipality, county etc. US law is very complicated. It isn't some monolith for all people all time everywhere dictated from the capital (like Napoleonic or Roman law).
Quote from: Baruch on June 23, 2019, 03:45:15 AM
In Belgium. EU constitution, or is there a Belgian one?
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/2950276.stm
In the US we have powers delegated to states, to counties, to municipalities. And anything else is reserved for the people. EU people are subjects, not citizens. Of course by-laws by some church, can't overrule higher authority. Not municipality, county etc. US law is very complicated. It isn't some monolith for all people all time everywhere dictated from the capital (like Napoleonic or Roman law).
Unconstitutional in American terms, of course.
Your constitution states a clear divide between church and state. A state-approved and recognized church-police-force seems in direct contrast, to me.
Quote from: Mr.Obvious on June 23, 2019, 04:57:20 AM
Unconstitutional in American terms, of course.
Your constitution states a clear divide between church and state. A state-approved and recognized church-police-force seems in direct contrast, to me.
Popular understanding is always inaccurate ;-) US Constitution doesn't limit what people can do, it limits what Feds can do. Only the Feds. How it applies to lower jurisdictions is exactly what created the Civil War (nullification). eg: can Federal prohibition of slavery, trump state or local law. It is up to the courts always to interpret. Including resolving conflict between jurisdictions.
Because the Confederacy rejected the jurisdiction of the Federal government (aka seceded) that made peaceful resolution impossible. Even slave holders were against nullification, President Andrew Jackson threatened to invade S Carolina, if they tried that while he was in office. Neither could Lincoln, for the same reasons.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separation_of_church_and_state_in_the_United_States
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..." ... that's it, not some long winded argument from Marx. Interpretation is up to the courts. Not up to the people. Most Americans are religious, even if we don't agree on religion. Our religion will always impact how we vote and govern.
"establishment ..." as in the Queen is the head of the Anglican Church. Originally, that meant, 300 years ago, it was illegal to be atheist, or to be Catholic etc, a capital crime. Our founders didn't want that here. Notice "free exercise thereof ..." what does that mean? The Feds can't create a state religion (aka Anglicanism, Marxism etc), aka something mandatory or to prohibit. I am free to worship anything I want, or nothing at all. And with freedom of assembly, I can assemble with people who are like minded.
So what can a state do? Shrugs. What can a county or municipality do? The point of law, is to force my neighbors to do something they don't want to do (cut their grass), or to force them to not do something they want to do (leave dog doodoo). That is what the whole point of law is. Organized tyranny. Hence the less "state" the better. Tyranny is inevitable, given the inexorable failures of human nature.
Ever read the Federalist Papers or Anti-Federalist Papers? Federalism prevents over centralization of power. No papacy, no royalty, no dictatorship.
Why are churches trying to protect themselves? Because Marxist Einstatz-gruppen are going around shooting up congregations (not really). Paranoia. Usually with mega-churches there is a problem with parking on Sunday, and that requires some parking officials to organize the process of coming and going (to prevent accidents). I don't care for mega-churches.
Really, I expect only further escalation. Roving gangs of armed Brownshirts outing and shooting liberals ;-(
I'd rather see organizations with these designated armed people than just allowing everyone to carry a firearm with the intent of being the hero in a time of crisis. The "good guy with a gun" theory is just retarded. And let's face it, it's more like "white guy with a gun".
Maybe a designated and trained person or group of people will be able to better recognize who the "good guy" is and who is the "bad guy with the gun" in a situation like a mass church shooting. It's hard enough for law enforcement.
But let's not kid ourselves. The second amendment is for white people.
With churches the "good guy" is the one who believes everything the Holy Horseshitter up front says and who contributes the most money.
Everyone else is suspect.
Frankly I don't have an issue with this yet.
A. I have no intention of going on said grounds.
B. Peeps who are going there for reasons other than being part of the activities should not go.
C. Don't need a C
Quote from: Baruch on June 23, 2019, 07:23:13 AM
Popular understanding is always inaccurate ;-) US Constitution doesn't limit what people can do, it limits what Feds can do. Only the Feds. How it applies to lower jurisdictions is exactly what created the Civil War (nullification). eg: can Federal prohibition of slavery, trump state or local law. It is up to the courts always to interpret. Including resolving conflict between jurisdictions.
Because the Confederacy rejected the jurisdiction of the Federal government (aka seceded) that made peaceful resolution impossible. Even slave holders were against nullification, President Andrew Jackson threatened to invade S Carolina, if they tried that while he was in office. Neither could Lincoln, for the same reasons.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separation_of_church_and_state_in_the_United_States
"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..." ... that's it, not some long winded argument from Marx. Interpretation is up to the courts. Not up to the people. Most Americans are religious, even if we don't agree on religion. Our religion will always impact how we vote and govern.
"establishment ..." as in the Queen is the head of the Anglican Church. Originally, that meant, 300 years ago, it was illegal to be atheist, or to be Catholic etc, a capital crime. Our founders didn't want that here. Notice "free exercise thereof ..." what does that mean? The Feds can't create a state religion (aka Anglicanism, Marxism etc), aka something mandatory or to prohibit. I am free to worship anything I want, or nothing at all. And with freedom of assembly, I can assemble with people who are like minded.
So what can a state do? Shrugs. What can a county or municipality do? The point of law, is to force my neighbors to do something they don't want to do (cut their grass), or to force them to not do something they want to do (leave dog doodoo). That is what the whole point of law is. Organized tyranny. Hence the less "state" the better. Tyranny is inevitable, given the inexorable failures of human nature.
Ever read the Federalist Papers or Anti-Federalist Papers? Federalism prevents over centralization of power. No papacy, no royalty, no dictatorship.
Why are churches trying to protect themselves? Because Marxist Einstatz-gruppen are going around shooting up congregations (not really). Paranoia. Usually with mega-churches there is a problem with parking on Sunday, and that requires some parking officials to organize the process of coming and going (to prevent accidents). I don't care for mega-churches.
Really, I expect only further escalation. Roving gangs of armed Brownshirts outing and shooting liberals ;-(
Tell that to the yanks in before and during the civil war. No, the feds are the government and the states who invite such savage bullshit that contradict the constitution should be shown in force what the feds can do. The state is only a state, and lower level compared to the federal government.
Protect your theism with your bullshit logic elsewhere, for when a state governor signs a bill for a church militia that ruins the safety of our multicultural and religion or lack of religion by favoring a protestant church that has been known to be really racist.
Quote from: Mermaid on June 23, 2019, 01:04:31 PM
I'd rather see organizations with these designated armed people than just allowing everyone to carry a firearm with the intent of being the hero in a time of crisis. The "good guy with a gun" theory is just retarded. And let's face it, it's more like "white guy with a gun".
Maybe a designated and trained person or group of people will be able to better recognize who the "good guy" is and who is the "bad guy with the gun" in a situation like a mass church shooting. It's hard enough for law enforcement.
But let's not kid ourselves. The second amendment is for white people.
Yes, and all colored folks are Cuban communists, right? The Left is so racist ... but OK as long as self hating.
But I agree, church groups or corporations that keep internal security, need to be regulated and licensed. We know the regular police won't do anything. They are there for the coffee and donuts and pensions. And no, I don't think teachers should be armed. A large HS might have local security, again licensed. In Tombstone, the Clantons got afoul of the city ordnance about carrying a gun in town. That was 1882 in the Wild West. This is why I am opposed to "open carry" and "concealed carry" unless you are properly deputized (licensed as a public or private security officer like the Earps).
If guns are White, then I encourage Blacks to lock and load. If guns are male, then I encourage women to lock and load. No need for such nice folks to miss out.
Quote from: Draconic Aiur on June 23, 2019, 04:15:09 PM
Tell that to the yanks in before and during the civil war. No, the feds are the government and the states who invite such savage bullshit that contradict the constitution should be shown in force what the feds can do. The state is only a state, and lower level compared to the federal government.
Protect your theism with your bullshit logic elsewhere, for when a state governor signs a bill for a church militia that ruins the safety of our multicultural and religion or lack of religion by favoring a protestant church that has been known to be really racist.
That wasn't settled until 1865, the hard way. Would have been nice to be settled peacefully, but the South were asshats. The Yanks were nearly as bad. New England wanted to secede before the South did. And Washington DC should have invaded them if they tried it. George Washington as President took to the field to suppress .. incorrect understanding of individual rights.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whiskey_Rebellion
In this case, against rebels in Pennsylvania.
Sorry, I am not in a multicultural EU hell-hole ;-) I am in a multicultural US hell-hole ;-)) If you have a problem with local jurisdictions licensing local security forces for churches or corporations ... then run for office and change the law in the local jurisdiction. Or try to suppress all law at all sub-jurisdictions, from Washington DC, if you dare. Multicultural totalitarianism ... is totalitarian. No matter how much nice frosting you put on it.
Yes, atheists do believe, unless they have a dictatorship run by them, they can't be safe. Gays believe, unless they have a dictatorship run by them, they can't be safe. Grow some balls. Dictatorship by the gay atheist proletariat, comrade? ;-))
Quote from: Baruch on June 23, 2019, 04:34:38 PM
That wasn't settled until 1865, the hard way. Would have been nice to be settled peacefully, but the South were asshats. The Yanks were nearly as bad. New England wanted to secede before the South did. And Washington DC should have invaded them if they tried it. George Washington as President took to the field to suppress .. incorrect understanding of individual rights.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Whiskey_Rebellion
In this case, against rebels in Pennsylvania.
Sorry, I am not in a multicultural EU hell-hole ;-) I am in a multicultural US hell-hole ;-)) If you have a problem with local jurisdictions licensing local security forces for churches or corporations ... then run for office and change the law in the local jurisdiction. Or try to suppress all law at all sub-jurisdictions, from Washington DC, if you dare. Multicultural totalitarianism ... is totalitarian. No matter how much nice frosting you put on it.
Yes, atheists do believe, unless they have a dictatorship run by them, they can't be safe. Gays believe, unless they have a dictatorship run by them, they can't be safe. Grow some balls. Dictatorship by the gay atheist proletariat, comrade? ;-))
blah blah blah your logic belongs in a gutter
Quote from: Draconic Aiur on June 25, 2019, 05:07:53 PM
blah blah blah your logic belongs in a gutter
Ad hominem = Latin term, requires an education. Blah blah blah = incoherent babbling.
How 'bout yada yada yada? That's not Latin.
;-P
Quote from: Unbeliever on June 25, 2019, 05:43:13 PM
How 'bout "yada yada yada? That's not Latin.
;-P
Pali adverb (related to Sanskrit, Pali is to the Buddha as Aramaic is to Jesus). Repetition is also valid in Pali grammar.
Quote from: Baruch on June 23, 2019, 04:27:48 PM
Yes, and all colored folks are Cuban communists, right? The Left is so racist ... but OK as long as self hating.
What?
Quote from: Mermaid on June 25, 2019, 07:27:06 PM
What?
Don't hurt yourself trying to figure out what Baruch is talking about. It's an exercise in futility.
Quote from: Unbeliever on June 25, 2019, 07:29:30 PM
Don't hurt yourself trying to figure out what Baruch is talking about. It's an exercise in futility.
The medium takes things out of context, unless we quote, or post immediately afterward. Elementary, my dear Unbeliever.
Quote from: Unbeliever on June 25, 2019, 07:29:30 PM
Don't hurt yourself trying to figure out what Baruch is talking about. It's an exercise in futility.
And Yet its hard to ignore...
Quote from: Draconic Aiur on June 26, 2019, 02:42:51 AM
And Yet its hard to ignore...
Members of SDS, in suspended animation in Berkeley CA since 1969 ... are demi-gods. No need to pay attention to anything else, other than MJ, Acid Rock etc ... you know, the whole Cali culture thing.
Easy to ignore. Unless one is SJW. SJW can't stand the mere existence of anyone not 100% devoted to their insane ideologies. It is Jim Jones, without the Kool Aide.
Quote from: Unbeliever on June 25, 2019, 07:29:30 PM
Don't hurt yourself trying to figure out what Baruch is talking about. It's an exercise in futility.
No courses on the Baruchistani language available. I've checked.
At least Baruch doesn't recite Vogon poetry! LOL
Quote from: Unbeliever on June 26, 2019, 01:24:56 PM
At least Baruch doesn't recite Vogon poetry! LOL
Quote
ÜÜ Ü Ü—ÜÜÜ ÜŸÜ¥ÜŸÜܣܛÜÜ¢
ܦܪÜÜܣܥ
ܟܥܟÜܣܛÜÜ¢
ܟܥܟÜܣܛÜÜ¢Ü
ܦܥܦܥ
Ü ÜÜ'ܥܪܛÜ
Ü ÜÜ'ܥܪÜܛܥ
The prophecies of Pepe, priest of Kek ... are much better than Vogon poetry.
Quote from: Unbeliever on June 22, 2019, 08:05:48 PM
I lived in Alabama as a small child, and then we left. It's never been the same since.
So... It's YOUR fault?
j/k
Quote from: Cavebear on July 13, 2019, 01:48:42 PM
So... It's YOUR fault?
j/k
Yeah...I feel so guilty! And I'm not even Jewish!
Quote from: Munch on June 22, 2019, 09:07:42 PM
Be an interesting experiment. Makes me think of this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wjjPlEW9bRM
Munch, thank you! In the depths of my most midnight dreams, where everything is as weird as possible (for me), I could not come up with the stuff Carlin imagines...
Quote from: Unbeliever on July 13, 2019, 01:52:55 PM
Yeah...I feel so guilty! And I'm not even Jewish!
Self-hate isn't limited to Jews. Gentiles should self hate too, but they are unselfconscious.
"Imagined". I forgot...
Quote from: Cavebear on July 13, 2019, 02:16:09 PM
"Imagined". I forgot...
Do government workers have an imagination? (rhetorical)
Quote from: Baruch on July 13, 2019, 02:27:49 PM
Do government workers have an imagination? (rhetorical)
More than you might think. I crashed Multiplan and they actually called we to learn what I did and learned to read the Sprint data CD's telecom database. I just loved working for the Government (in a benefical way). Public service; I'm a real Boy Scout...
Quote from: Baruch on July 13, 2019, 02:11:07 PM
Self-hate isn't limited to Jews. Gentiles should self hate too, but they are unselfconscious.
Damn son, you sound like a fundy preacher man with the demand that sheeple practice self hate and self loathing. Original sin thing?
Quote from: Feral Atheist on August 31, 2019, 05:19:48 PM
Damn son, you sound like a fundy preacher man with the demand that sheeple practice self hate and self loathing. Original sin thing?
"Son"?
But no, only Baruch can call me a preacher. You haven't earned the right. I'm feeling a bit obnoxious right now. Let's examine what you said.
1. Fundy preacher - I back up my statements with logic and facts.
2. "Sheeple" - That an alt-right phrase. I trust "people" to make good decisions about Presidents. Ever read "They Also Ran'?
3. "Original Sin" is for superstitious idiots.
4. I am not the least "self-loathing". I love who I am and not the least bit ashamed. And I don't mean that in a "support my kind" sense. I really like myself. I think my posts demonstrate that.
Is that the best you can offer? I snort nose mucus in your general direction...
Quote from: Cavebear on August 31, 2019, 06:41:29 PM
"Son"?
But no, only Baruch can call me a preacher. You haven't earned the right. I'm feeling a bit obnoxious right now. Let's examine what you said.
1. Fundy preacher - I back up my statements with logic and facts.
2. "Sheeple" - That an alt-right phrase. I trust "people" to make good decisions about Presidents. Ever read "They Also Ran'?
3. "Original Sin" is for superstitious idiots.
4. I am not the least "self-loathing". I love who I am and not the least bit ashamed. And I don't mean that in a "support my kind" sense. I really like myself. I think my posts demonstrate that.
Is that the best you can offer? I snort nose mucus in your general direction...
I think, Cavebear, if you'll look again you'll see that he was talking to Baruch.
Quote from: Unbeliever on August 31, 2019, 06:49:20 PM
I think, Cavebear, if you'll look again you'll see that he was talking to Baruch.
You are correct. My apologies. Damn I get too involved sometimes...
Quote from: Cavebear on August 31, 2019, 07:06:00 PM
You are correct. My apologies. Damn I get too involved sometimes...
Of course I'm correct. I've never been wrong before, though I thought I was wrong once. Turned out I was mistaken about that.
:-P
Quote from: Unbeliever on August 31, 2019, 07:17:56 PM
Of course I'm correct. I've never been wrong before, though I thought I was wrong once. Turned out I was mistaken about that.
Well see, you are wrong. That MY line. LOL!
:-P
I heard that joke in 7th grade from a math teacher, who was also the football coach of the school. Only thing I remember from his class. LOL
Quote from: Unbeliever on August 31, 2019, 07:27:39 PM
I heard that joke in 7th grade from a math teacher, who was also the football coach of the school. Only thing I remember from his class. LOL
I'm trying to remember my 7th grade math... Complicated fractions? Maybe into to exponents?
"Why would they change math?" Mr. Incredible, Incredibles 2.
Quote from: Draconic Aiur on June 22, 2019, 07:56:14 PM
The beginning of the end of the Bill of Rights! Fucking idiots!
A bunch of new laws took effect here today. I believe that includes the one for this private police force.
Having said that, I am curious as to why this private police force would be different than a private police force at say Harvard or MIT? Assuming of course that the long standing private police forces at places like Harvard and MIT didn't end the Bill of Rights decades ago without my noticing.
Quote from: PopeyesPappy on September 01, 2019, 07:22:27 AM
A bunch of new laws took effect here today. I believe that includes the one for this private police force.
Having said that, I am curious as to why this private police force would be different than a private police force at say Harvard or MIT? Assuming of course that the long standing private police forces at places like Harvard and MIT didn't end the Bill of Rights decades ago without my noticing.
Police force good, if civil service under Democratic machine politics aka NYC, Chicago ...
Personally I am opposed to private police forces. And the militarization of the regular police force. And capital seizure (aka robbery).
Nothing quite reinforces that belief that god will protect you like surrounding yourself with a small army.
Quote from: aitm on September 01, 2019, 09:48:43 AM
Nothing quite reinforces that belief that god will protect you like surrounding yourself with a small army.
How did that help JFK when the Secret Service fired the kill shot from behind?
Quote from: PopeyesPappy on September 01, 2019, 07:22:27 AM
A bunch of new laws took effect here today. I believe that includes the one for this private police force.
Having said that, I am curious as to why this private police force would be different than a private police force at say Harvard or MIT? Assuming of course that the long standing private police forces at places like Harvard and MIT didn't end the Bill of Rights decades ago without my noticing.
Because "private police forces" are not actually police with all the training that involves. They are more "private security forces" with little law enforcement experience and a very focused "act first and worry about the consequences later" attitude.
Quote from: Cavebear on September 03, 2019, 01:11:39 AM
Because "private police forces" are not actually police with all the training that involves. They are more "private security forces" with little law enforcement experience and a very focused "act first and worry about the consequences later" attitude.
Do you know how much or what kind of training these people will receive before starting to work? I don't, but I do know they will have to complete state certified training by the Peace Officers Standards and Training Commission and be trained on the proper use of a non-lethal weapon before starting to work. I don't necessarily see it as a bad thing if they receive less than your average city, county, or state cop either since many people believe one of the reasons today's police are so trigger happy is the training they receive.
None of that helps explain to me why allowing a church that operates a school with hundreds or thousands of students would be different than allowing a private non-church affiliated university like Harvard to do the same. Private police forces at universities have been a thing as long as I can remember, and I don't recall anyone bitching about them being a threat to the bill of rights. What's the difference?
Quote from: PopeyesPappy on September 03, 2019, 07:39:47 AM
Do you know how much or what kind of training these people will receive before starting to work? I don't, but I do know they will have to complete state certified training by the Peace Officers Standards and Training Commission and be trained on the proper use of a non-lethal weapon before starting to work. I don't necessarily see it as a bad thing if they receive less than your average city, county, or state cop either since many people believe one of the reasons today's police are so trigger happy is the training they receive.
None of that helps explain to me why allowing a church that operates a school with hundreds or thousands of students would be different than allowing a private non-church affiliated university like Harvard to do the same. Private police forces at universities have been a thing as long as I can remember, and I don't recall anyone bitching about them being a threat to the bill of rights. What's the difference?
Well, I can present a few objections and considerations...
First, I didn't say and wouldn't grant that Private Secular College or Religious College police are much different. In my experience with both, they are a bit crazy and are made up of people who can't get jobs with regular police forces because they are not qualified for actual police jobs. They are more accurately called "Security Staff" or something like that for a reason.
Second, I loved the way you described Harvard as a private non-church affiliated university, as if church affiliation was generally required for a university. Do you often fool yourself much that way?
Third, you said "I don't necessarily see it as a bad thing if they receive less than your average city, county, or state cop". OK, that is a straight admission that they don't. I'll give you an example of what it takes to get a job at the top level of State Cop.
We had a guy in the dorm who was a utter fruitcake. He would walk around naked. He once stood on the back bumper naked while a friend drove around the dorms at the U of MD with a cape on his back and holding a flaming broom.
That guy became a State Cop and apparently he was better to the State Cops then the applicants they considered even more deranged.
Nuff said?
Quote from: Cavebear on September 03, 2019, 08:20:09 AM
Nuff said?
Not really.
QuoteFirst, I didn't say and wouldn't grant that Private Secular College or Religious College police are much different. In my experience with both, they are a bit crazy and are made up of people who can't get jobs with regular police forces because they are not qualified for actual police jobs. They are more accurately called "Security Staff" or something like that for a reason.
I asked a question of the OP. What makes a church affiliated private police force a threat to the Bill of Rights when a private university isn't considered so? Your reply was lack of training. I asked you how that made them different from a private university police force. Apparently in your opinion it doesn't.
QuoteSecond, I loved the way you described Harvard as a private non-church affiliated university, as if church affiliation was generally required for a university. Do you often fool yourself much that way?
What the fuck are you talking about, Cavebear? I specifically called out Harvard because it is a private as opposed to a public university. How you got from there to I think church affiliation is required of a university is beyond my comprehension.
QuoteThird, you said "I don't necessarily see it as a bad thing if they receive less than your average city, county, or state cop". OK, that is a straight admission that they don't. I'll give you an example of what it takes to get a job at the top level of State Cop.
Can you read? If so then nice straw man. I didn't admit less training would be required. I asked you if you how much would be required. I said I didn't know how much would be required. I said their training would have to state certified, and it would include the use of nonlethal force. I also said less training wouldn't necessarily be a bad thing bad thing because many think the training modern police officers get results in them shooting more people than they need to. That isn't under training. It is over training.
Quote from: PopeyesPappy on September 03, 2019, 08:43:10 AM
Not really.
I asked a question of the OP. What makes a church affiliated private police force a threat to the Bill of Rights when a private university isn't considered so? Your reply was lack of training. I asked you how that made them different from a private university police force. Apparently in your opinion it doesn't.
What the fuck are you talking about, Cavebear? I specifically called out Harvard because it is a private as opposed to a public university. How you got from there to I think church affiliation is required of a university is beyond my comprehension.
Can you read? If so then nice straw man. I didn't admit less training would be required. I asked you if you how much would be required. I said I didn't know how much would be required. I said their training would have to state certified, and it would include the use of nonlethal force. I also said lC.
You think you said more than you said.
And I especially liked you saying that "A bunch of new laws took effect here today. I believe that includes the one for this private police force."
I very specifically object to private police forces. Those are just wannabe cops (as crazy as some of them are) but not even qualified for that.
I assume that private police forces must maintain themselves within restricted locations. It would turn into a shit fest if all of a sudden they were allowed to join in with public forces outside their locations. And just as surely as multiple municipalities have agreements allowing crossing of municipal boundaries, it could be a matter of time before PoDunk Baptist police force joins in high speed chase through Arkansas.
Quote from: aitm on September 03, 2019, 10:54:55 AM
I assume that private police forces must maintain themselves within restricted locations. It would turn into a shit fest if all of a sudden they were allowed to join in with public forces outside their locations. And just as surely as multiple municipalities have agreements allowing crossing of municipal boundaries, it could be a matter of time before PoDunk Baptist police force joins in high speed chase through Arkansas.
I worry that any religious college will naturally select religious security applicants who would, in turn, naturally forgive religious visitors of all crimes and actually hide the events. And even actively be against anyone who was not religious. It would almost be their job description. It would at least be a basic assumption.
Quote from: Cavebear on September 03, 2019, 12:36:34 PM
I worry that any religious college will naturally select religious security applicants who would, in turn, naturally forgive religious visitors of all crimes and actually hide the events. And even actively be against anyone who was not religious. It would almost be their job description. It would at least be a basic assumption.
Yes. And communist organizations hire fellow communists. Do you shit your pants over other people's problems? Good, lets put you in charge of hiring every security guard and policeman. To help with paranoia.
Rent-a-cops are notorious for making poor decisions in tight situations.
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on September 03, 2019, 01:04:39 PM
Rent-a-cops are notorious for making poor decisions in tight situations.
That's my point... Better said than I did. Thanks.
We used to call them the "Hertz Rent-A-Cops". Qualified to keep peace at the local McDonalds. Many of them were security guards at the malls I worked in for a few years because they just weren't qualified to get a serious cop job. And to be fair, they wanted to be good at their jobs. I don't demean their DESIRE. But for most of them, it was just a step up from warehouse work and they had no real training in police work.
They were large, had a baton, and a cheap badge. But if there had been a shot fired, they would have run like hell. They didn't have a gun. No mall would have trusted them with one.
Mall cops are a meme. I feel sorry for them having to deal with the teen punks. Good thing all the malls are going bankrupt.