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Arts and Entertainment => Film, Music, Sports, and more => Topic started by: SGOS on December 19, 2017, 10:37:04 AM

Title: Westworld TV Series
Post by: SGOS on December 19, 2017, 10:37:04 AM
Season 1 is now out on DVD, and scheduled to arrive at my house on Friday.  I haven't seen it because I don't have TV and don't stream, but based on the positive reception and forum discussions from last year, and also because the old movie is wonderful, I'm expecting it to be worth buying.  The thing is, I haven't heard anyone talking about season two, and I haven't followed the TV series thread that closely.  I'm just wondering if people here still think it's as good as it was the first season.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Sal1981 on December 19, 2017, 01:16:57 PM
I still haven't watched any episodes of season 2, but going off the end of season 1, it's gonna be quite a different setting than in season 1, very different.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: SGOS on December 19, 2017, 01:58:33 PM
I still haven't watched any episodes of season 2, but going off the end of season 1, it's gonna be quite a different setting than in season 1, very different.
Hmm, that could be good or bad.  But then I haven't seen season 1 yet.  The movie was unique, almost like a genre in itself when you include Jurassic Park, fantasy theme parks that go haywire.  I find such a concept intriguing.  I'm looking forward to Westworld, and the DVD release is a surprise.  I had heard rumors last year that the series would not be released to DVD in the foreseeable future.  I wonder if that was started just to get more people to sign up for streaming?
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on December 19, 2017, 05:27:39 PM
Season 1 is now out on DVD, and scheduled to arrive at my house on Friday.  I haven't seen it because I don't have TV and don't stream, but based on the positive reception and forum discussions from last year, and also because the old movie is wonderful, I'm expecting it to be worth buying.
Yes, it's worth buying.  It was an amazing ride.  I pulled my roommate over and practically clockwork oranged him into watching.

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The thing is, I haven't heard anyone talking about season two, and I haven't followed the TV series thread that closely.
Aside from a short trailer, we know next to nothing about season two.  It isn't due to air until summer 2018.

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I'm just wondering if people here still think it's as good as it was the first season.
Virtually any discussion of season 2 would spoil season 1.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Cavebear on December 23, 2017, 10:42:50 AM
Daring the risk of social shunning, I have never even heard of this show.  On the other hand, I never watched 'Dallas' or 'Baywatch' or (insert 'must see" shows).  And I do have a HDTV...
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Baruch on December 23, 2017, 11:36:20 AM
Daring the risk of social shunning, I have never even heard of this show.  On the other hand, I never watched 'Dallas' or 'Baywatch' or (insert 'must see" shows).  And I do have a HDTV...

New Media are pay-per-view.  I won't pay.  From the website ...

"Set at the intersection of the near future and the reimagined past, explore a world in which every human appetite, no matter how noble or depraved, can be indulged without consequence."

Sounds just like Republicans to me ;-(
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on December 23, 2017, 12:20:50 PM
Daring the risk of social shunning, I have never even heard of this show.
That's understandable.  Not all HBO shows get nearly as much press as Game of Thrones.  Plus it only aired for 2 months with about a 2 year wait between seasons.  So there's a brief but frenetic flurry of fan activity and then long stretches of inactivity.  Very easy to miss.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on December 23, 2017, 12:27:59 PM
From the website ...

"Set at the intersection of the near future and the reimagined past, explore a world in which every human appetite, no matter how noble or depraved, can be indulged without consequence."
That's the intent of the company that owns the titular amusement park, but that's not completely accurate.  There's a much deeper story going on underneath the corporate-approved mindless violence and debauchery.

Plus, the same guy who wrote Jurassic Park also wrote Westworld.  'Nuff said.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Cavebear on December 23, 2017, 12:56:47 PM
New Media are pay-per-view.  I won't pay.  From the website ...

"Set at the intersection of the near future and the reimagined past, explore a world in which every human appetite, no matter how noble or depraved, can be indulged without consequence."

Sounds just like Republicans to me ;-(

(koff, koff) yes...
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Baruch on December 23, 2017, 02:02:37 PM
(koff, koff) yes...

The part I hate about the original story, is that all the IT people die.  Bad form, that.  Yul Brynner was awesome however.  Marshal Dillon wouldn't have survived him.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: SGOS on December 23, 2017, 02:24:05 PM
The part I hate about the original story, is that all the IT people die.  Bad form, that.  Yul Brynner was awesome however.  Marshal Dillon wouldn't have survived him.
I've watched one episode now.  I'm going to like this.  I can tell.  Plenty of stuff to guess about and lots of ways for it all to shake out.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Cavebear on December 23, 2017, 02:34:35 PM
I've watched one episode now.  I'm going to like this.  I can tell.  Plenty of stuff to guess about and lots of ways for it all to shake out.

Will it have good arcs like Babylon 5?
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: SGOS on December 23, 2017, 02:52:50 PM
Will it have good arcs like Babylon 5?
I didn't follow Babylon 5, maybe an episode or two.  I'm not sure what you mean by "arcs."  If you mean story lines, philosophical questions, and commentary on the human condition, the potential is certainly there, but with just one episode, I can't say how much it will develop those things.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Cavebear on December 23, 2017, 03:56:10 PM
I didn't follow Babylon 5, maybe an episode or two.  I'm not sure what you mean by "arcs."  If you mean story lines, philosophical questions, and commentary on the human condition, the potential is certainly there, but with just one episode, I can't say how much it will develop those things.

Arcs are multi-episode plots.  Babylon 5 was noted for that.  As opposed to some shows where the characters basically started from scratch each time, like Star Trek or any sitcom.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on December 23, 2017, 05:09:26 PM
Will it have good arcs like Babylon 5?
Depends on what you mean.  But 4 characters go through major character arcs in the first season.  Not bad for 10 episodes.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on December 23, 2017, 05:15:41 PM
Arcs are multi-episode plots.  Babylon 5 was noted for that.  As opposed to some shows where the characters basically started from scratch each time, like Star Trek or any sitcom.
Westworld is defintely a serial tv show.  Every episode flows from the previous episode.  You can't miss an episode and still understand what's going on.  Hell, you have to rewatch episodes to fully understand what's going on.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Cavebear on December 26, 2017, 06:13:39 AM
Depends on what you mean.  But 4 characters go through major character arcs in the first season.  Not bad for 10 episodes.

Character arcs sound good but probably not quite the same as a I mean.  Arcs are more situations that develop over months at least, where hints of developments show slightly at first and them episodes later you realize that THAT'S why he did that (or some such thing).

I suppose that is cheaply common in soap operas, but not often seen in sci-fi.  Dr Who does that sometimes.  ST:TNG did it badly with Wessley and better with Data.

But in Babylon 5, it wasn't character arcs but universe arcs.  I read something by one of the writers saying that they had planned out a whole ending before the wrote the begginning, and everything led to the end in slow arcs skipping entire episodes sometimes to get to one point months in the future.

Naturally, it isn't in repeats...  Too complicated.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: SGOS on December 26, 2017, 08:22:06 AM
Character arcs.  Foreshadows and twists?  There are two so far after 7 episodes.  One I anticipated just a few minutes before the revelation.  Others seem to be under development as I'm not so sure about Character X or Y as I was at the beginning.  I'm experiencing a bit of what I used to in time travel stories, potential problems that arise in artificial intelligent beings as happens when considering traveling in time.  The first three episodes were confusing.  I watched each one twice, trying to keep up.  By episode four, I'm starting to feel like I've found my bearings, partly because I've come to accept that a couple of the major plot lines cannot be understood at this point.  This is a very good series, on par with Dexter and Breaking Bad, where each episode does not resolve itself, but are part of the overall plot.  It lends itself to binge watching, where you don't have to wait weeks before the next episode.  But soon I'll be done with season 1 and I'll have to wait a whole year for the next binge, and that will drive me crazy.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Cavebear on December 26, 2017, 10:41:20 AM
Character arcs.  Foreshadows and twists?  There are two so far after 7 episodes.  One I anticipated just a few minutes before the revelation.  Others seem to be under development as I'm not so sure about Character X or Y as I was at the beginning.  I'm experiencing a bit of what I used to in time travel stories, potential problems that arise in artificial intelligent beings as happens when considering traveling in time.  The first three episodes were confusing.  I watched each one twice, trying to keep up.  By episode four, I'm starting to feel like I've found my bearings, partly because I've come to accept that a couple of the major plot lines cannot be understood at this point.  This is a very good series, on par with Dexter and Breaking Bad, where each episode does not resolve itself, but are part of the overall plot.  It lends itself to binge watching, where you don't have to wait weeks before the next episode.  But soon I'll be done with season 1 and I'll have to wait a whole year for the next binge, and that will drive me crazy.

Perhaps I've underestimated newer series...
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: SGOS on December 28, 2017, 02:55:48 PM
Holy Smoke!  What a first season.  I just finished the final episode, and I'm trying to put my mind back together.  I've read two books by Michael Crichton, I think, and this doesn't seem like the same writer.  In the past, Crichton wrote in a  linier format.  Maybe this was too, but I'm not sure, and I'm not just talking about the obvious flashbacks.  Eventually, I didn't know if I was watching flashbacks or the present time.

There is a philosophical concept that time is not linier, but that the past, present, and future are all happening at the same time.  I put no stock in that, but Westworld kind of captures the spirit of that particular brain fart.  Perhaps after a second watching, I'll sort through that and decide if this was linier or not.  Or maybe not.  Much as been resolved in the final episode, but I still have a ton of questions about what just happened.

Last year, I read some user reviews.  Maybe from Amazon.  I can't remember.  Many people bemoaned the egregious use of nudity.  For some, that's all they noticed.  Not even a comment about the plot, the twists, and the complexity.  Just comments along the lines of, "If bare breasts are all you want, you may find this series interesting."  Sheesh!  Talk about living in different worlds.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on December 28, 2017, 09:39:36 PM
Holy Smoke!  What a first season.  I just finished the final episode, and I'm trying to put my mind back together.
Yeah, that last 5 minutes or so was quite a doozy. 

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There is a philosophical concept that time is not linear, but that the past, present, and future are all happening at the same time.
Block time - not so much that everything's happening at once, but that future has already happened in exactly the same sense that the past has already happened.  The big picture is that spacetime is an unchanging 4-dimensional block.  That picture doesn't gel with people's subjective experience, but very little of reality meets that standard.  If I held a boulder in my hands and told you that it's mostly empty space, you'd likely consider me mad.

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Many people bemoaned the egregious use of nudity.
Considering all the nasty stuff that goes down in Westworld, it's odd that nudity is a big complaint.  It's so strange that you can show violence galore without consequence but an f-bomb or bare breast sends the moral guardians into conniptions.

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Just comments along the lines of, "If bare breasts are all you want, you may find this series interesting."  Sheesh!  Talk about living in different worlds.
Softcore porn would be way more efficient for that.  Besides, the context of a lot of Westworld's nudity (body heaps with sad music playing) isn't exactly an enticing scenario.  At least, I'd hope not.

But yeah, Westworld has a lot more to offer than mere titillation (in fact, that's the show's metanarrative).  Imo, anyone who would sum it up as guns and tits isn't be smart enough to be hired as a security guard at the titular park.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Baruch on December 28, 2017, 09:51:27 PM
Puritans ... sex bad, violence good.  That is what Salem was all about.  Americans are all from Salem.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: SGOS on December 29, 2017, 06:37:05 AM
Considering all the nasty stuff that goes down in Westworld, it's odd that nudity is a big complaint.  It's so strange that you can show violence galore without consequence but an f-bomb or bare breast sends the moral guardians into conniptions.
The nudity is more on the order of undressed store manikins.  When sex is about to take place, it's almost always clothed foreplay, and then the camera cuts away.

 
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on April 24, 2018, 10:08:00 PM
Season 2!

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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: SGOS on April 25, 2018, 02:14:22 AM
Season 2!

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I remember them talking about the outside world in the first year, and I did wonder what it was like.  To some of the robots who became aware, it struck me as a grass is greener better place, at least for some.  For others, it was more fearful, even though they were beginning to understand the nightmare of their own world.  For me as a viewer, I assumed the outside world was significantly advanced from ours, a place advanced enough to create Westworld, but suffering from the same political corruption and personal greed of our own world.

I didn't think much more about it than that. There might be bizarre aspects to the real world that would be an interesting twist.  And for the aware robots there could be some interesting interplay between the two worlds.  There already is of course, but the interplay all takes place in their own environment so far.

The visitors mostly have a strange quality to me, and seem unusually preoccupied with sex and violence, like when they laugh about how they kill a robot, they strike me as sick and evil types.  Maybe that's just the nature of the guests who bother visiting the park. Except for that one hero type guy whose trip has something to do with his boss who is picking up the tab for a reason that I don't yet understand.  So I wonder if the guests are representative of the outside or just some subgroup.

I'll have to wait until September for the disks, however.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Baruch on April 25, 2018, 06:21:24 AM
First Person Shooter ... it is sick, in some people's eyes.  This is just advanced FPS and GTA.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: SGOS on April 25, 2018, 09:50:23 AM
First Person Shooter ... it is sick, in some people's eyes.  This is just advanced FPS and GTA.
The guests can certainly be compared to video game players, but not typical of any that I know.  As a whole, they seem far more obsessed with Westworld than the average Grand Theft Auto fan is with their game, and I find the robots, even the bad asses and the snake woman, more likeable than the guests in general.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on April 25, 2018, 12:06:20 PM
The visitors mostly have a strange quality to me, and seem unusually preoccupied with sex and violence, like when they laugh about how they kill a robot, they strike me as sick and evil types.  Maybe that's just the nature of the guests who bother visiting the park. Except for that one hero type guy whose trip has something to do with his boss who is picking up the tab for a reason that I don't yet understand.  So I wonder if the guests are representative of the outside or just some subgroup.
A subgroup of thrill-seekers (rich assholes, as at least one character has described them).

Most of that might be Delos's fault.  They market Westworld as a place where you can "live without limits" and despite the family-friendly vibe of the commercial, most people quickly figure out what limits they're referring to.

And when visitors arrive, they're bombarded with quests to go kill some bandits and working girls calling to them.  Even if they refuse and stay in Sweetwater, eventually the bandits come to them.  It seems that Delos is almost entirely to blame for that place becoming a den of sex and violence.  Delos's new narratives become increasingly depraved (thanks, Sizemore) so naturally, the clientelle matches.

A few guests take a more PG route, but they're clearly the minority.  Given that Dolores' family-friendly painting session is a rare break between serving as a damsel in distress to be fought over, the park's PG offerings are more of an afterthought than the main intent.

So yes, the park guests are more likely to be sadistic sex fiends than the average person.  In fact, I expect non-guests and non-Delos people in particular to be far more conscientious and agreeable (like Felix), and less competitive and warlike (like the MiB)

Out of the big five personality traits, I suspect that park guests score through the roof in terms of Openness to new experience, Extraversion, and Neuroticism (quick to anger, psychologically unstable), while scoring low in Conscientiousness (more easy-going/careless than efficient/organized) and Agreeableness (more detached/competitive than friendly/compassionate).
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on April 25, 2018, 12:40:24 PM
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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on April 25, 2018, 12:58:35 PM
And while I'm on the subject, shortly after watching season 1 with my roommate, the milk in our fridge went bad.  I poured it out in the sink very dramatically while saying the famous "GROWIN' BOY" line.  I expected at least a chuckle in response.

No reaction.

/le sigh
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on April 30, 2018, 02:15:10 AM
s2e2

Well, I'll be damned.  I don't even know what to do with myself now.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: SGOS on April 30, 2018, 02:21:31 AM
s2e2

Well, I'll be damned.  I don't even know what to do with myself now.
Well that's fairly enigmatic.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on April 30, 2018, 03:11:39 AM
Well that's fairly enigmatic.
It makes sense given my earlier posts.

Spoiler-proof since you'd have to have both seen the episode and seen my earlier posts to understand my reaction.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Sal1981 on June 18, 2018, 09:11:11 AM

Just saw s2e9, the episode before the finale next Sunday.
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[/spoiler]
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on June 22, 2018, 11:26:58 AM
s2e2

Well, I'll be damned.  I don't even know what to do with myself now.
I'm going to go ahead and explain this since it's such a fascinating and oft-overlooked part of the show.

For a while (since the start of the show), I've been curious (obsessed) about what life is like outside the titular park.  Lots of people have theories about what's really going on IN Westworld.  I have theories about what's going on OUTSIDE of Westworld.

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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on June 22, 2018, 11:43:23 AM
Westworld S2E8 Kiksuya:

My second-favorite episode of Westworld after the season 1 finale.  It was that good.

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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Sal1981 on June 25, 2018, 10:18:39 AM
Season 2 le grand finale
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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on June 29, 2018, 12:53:17 PM
I liked the finale.  ...mostly.  It was certainly cool-looking, but there are some real head-scratchers here.  And not in a good way.  But overall, I'm happy with the resolution of the plot.

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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on August 14, 2018, 12:32:08 PM
I've been plowing through Westworld critiques lately and here's one that really caught my attention:

Contains both Westworld and Game of Thrones spoilers:

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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on April 03, 2020, 03:04:37 PM
So Westworld season 3 is out with more of all those things that we have always enjoyed: surprises and violence.

If you haven't caught up, just go ahead and watch it.  Chances are pretty good that you have enough free time now, lol.

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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on April 03, 2020, 03:19:45 PM
This guy makes a lot of sense:

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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on April 20, 2020, 09:18:53 AM
s3e6

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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Mike Cl on April 20, 2020, 10:40:13 AM
s3e6

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Not a 'theory', but an hypothesis--sorry, couldn't resist.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Sal1981 on April 20, 2020, 01:07:03 PM
episode 6. I don't know what I watched. Being drunk didn't help.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: SGOS on April 20, 2020, 01:20:45 PM
episode 6. I don't know what I watched. Being drunk didn't help.
From my experience with the first two seasons, it took most of my mental abilities to just to take a stab at keeping up.  I think the premise of the series is wonderful, but it's easy to feel lost half the time.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on April 20, 2020, 03:49:04 PM
Not a 'theory', but an hypothesis--sorry, couldn't resist.
Fan theory.  Theory in the colloquial sense!
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on April 20, 2020, 03:59:58 PM
From my experience with the first two seasons, it took most of my mental abilities to just to take a stab at keeping up.  I think the premise of the series is wonderful, but it's easy to feel lost half the time.
That's intentional.  Imo, season 1 did a beautiful job of foreshadowing major reveals.  A keen-eyed watcher might be able to guess some stuff.

In fact, fans did such a good job guessing for season 1 that the show creators felt the need to up their game and make season 2 impossible to crack.  And they succeed a little too well.  Season 2 was so inaccessible and complicated that it was nearly impossible to predict.  Fans were basically just stabbing in the dark.

Now, with season 3 the creators are going a little easier on us with a much more straightforward narrative.  Not to toot my own horn, but I guessed two out of three major reveals correctly.  The third is still ongoing, so we might not find that out until the season wraps up.

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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Sal1981 on May 04, 2020, 09:36:38 AM
Season 3: Crisis Theory (final episode of the season)

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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Baruch on May 04, 2020, 10:41:06 AM
Season 3: Crisis Theory (final episode of the season)

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I liked the joke, and I like your Feynman quote.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on May 04, 2020, 02:39:15 PM
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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on May 04, 2020, 03:03:05 PM
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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on May 04, 2020, 03:22:54 PM
Watching Westworld videos and the reviews fairly often get basic facts wrong and therefore misinterpret scenes.  *Ford chuckles to himself*

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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Sal1981 on May 05, 2020, 03:52:55 AM
Watching Westworld videos and the reviews fairly often get basic facts wrong and therefore misinterpret scenes.  *Ford chuckles to himself*

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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on May 05, 2020, 11:54:55 AM
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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on May 07, 2020, 01:22:06 PM
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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on May 07, 2020, 01:51:11 PM
A peak at the writers' room:

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Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: SGOS on September 09, 2020, 01:31:48 PM
A peak at the writers' room:

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Year 3 Episodes 1 to 3
I know that Delores wants to take over the real world, or have her revenge on it, or something like that, but that was kind of established in the second year.  Beyond that, I'm watching images of people talking in conspiratorial tones about things I don't understand, and can't figure out the point of it all.  This was hard enough to follow in the second year but I'm running out of curiosity.  I loved the movie, dated as it now is, but that was a hell of a story.  This seems more like nonobjective performance art designed to appeal to a sense I must not have.  Most of the original cast has not shown up in the latest set of disks, at least not yet.  Did they run for cover to save their careers?  The character I identify with most is:

Bernard
1) I want to understand
2) I don't understand
3) I don't get it

Except that Bernard seems more concerned, although I wished the writers would have given him better things to do.  I think this will be the last season for me.  Although Delores looks mighty fine in a slinky cocktail dress.  Beyond that... I want to understand.  I don't understand, I don't get it.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on September 09, 2020, 02:03:28 PM
Dolores's goals are hard to guess at because they always seem to be in flux.  In one scene, it's petty revenge and horrifically cruel at that (contradicting her merciful behavior).  In another, it's complete genocide.  In another, it's simple freedom.  I believe the writers did this obfuscation to deliberately try to keep her mysterious, but it really just makes her seem erratic and serves to take away from her character.  If the audience doesn't know who she is and what she wants, they can't sympathize with her.

I want to understand.  I don't understand, I don't get it.
*dons Ford's black hat*  Hardly your fault.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: SGOS on September 10, 2020, 06:31:20 PM
Episode 5 (I think) of year 3 was entertaining for sure, not that I got any real clarity from it.  OK, there's clarity but only in minor details, but with little direction toward a plot.  From the old West of Delos to upscale society on the order of James Bond casinos is an interesting contrast, and I enjoyed the elegant flesh market that Delores and Jesse Pinkman crashed. I got several unexpected laughs out of that.  The real world is every bit the fantasy of the theme park.  It's watchable if not understandable.  In season 2, I decided to just watch it without understanding, and I can do that again, but like I said, I'm running out of curiosity, although I think the settings, and acting will hold my interest a while longer.  It reminds me of a David Lynch production, although less corny.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: SGOS on September 10, 2020, 06:34:08 PM
I'm not sure they are in the real world yet.  Maybe it's just a bigger theme park.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on September 10, 2020, 10:07:19 PM
I'm not sure they are in the real world yet.  Maybe it's just a bigger theme park.
There's a fairly popular fan theory that this all takes place on the moon or Mars.  Yet there's no evidence to indicate that this doesn't take place on the Earth.

Still, there are certainly some incongruities.

In season 1, MiB says the the real world is one of plenty, where people's basic needs are met and disease has been eradicated.  And while people do have pretty decent living conditions, there is a wide gulf between rich and poor and poor people certainly do not live lives of plenty.  And not only does disease still exist (exhibit A: Caleb's mom), Caleb struggles to pay for treatment.  And there's also a pretty noticeable criminal element, with a disturbingly large amount of "wetwork" (murder)

It's also alluded to that there's some extensive eugenics going on - not just the elimination of genetic defects but also cultivating certain personality traits.  Felix says something to Sylvester to that effect.  This system apparently had one hell of an oversight with the MiB (and a small fraction of people who share his personality).

This isn't enough to call bullshit, and part of that can be explained by an unreliable pov, but the show in general seems to have all the hallmarks of on-the-fly-rewrites that leave these sorts of incongruities whenever the writers decide to take the show in a different direction.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: SGOS on September 11, 2020, 08:38:25 AM
but the show in general seems to have all the hallmarks of on-the-fly-rewrites that leave these sorts of incongruities whenever the writers decide to take the show in a different direction.
I keep thinking there is some overall goal that the plot works toward, but I suppose it's not necessary to follow that form.  Mini plots are used quite often in serial comedy, but not usually in serious drama.  There can be subplots of course.  The premise of androids getting loose and functioning outside the park is a good one.

I never watched the series Lost, but a friend told me before the final reveal that the point of the show was for viewers to figure out what was happening.  In the end, I understand it was just someone dreaming, which I think would be a  let down for fans.  But I suppose it depends on how it was done.

I did enjoy Season 3s 5th episode, but it's hard to explain why.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on September 11, 2020, 01:43:50 PM
I did enjoy Season 3s 5th episode, but it's hard to explain why.
Because that episode had weight.  There was a huge reveal to the entire world - a major shakeup in the status quo - and it had an enormous personal impact.  So it was a major big picture and small picture event.  Audiences understood both the big picture ramifications and the individual sadness and anger at being used by a system that knows everything about them but doesn't care at all about their wellbeing (remind you of anything?)

The beginning of the episode also revealed a lot about the "villain".  And there's also a decent amount of action, all during a weird drug trip, all culminating in a sobering tragic death.

For most shows, that would have been a season finale.  But for Westworld, that was just a mid-season escalation.  There's a reason I still like this show, even if it does have its faults.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: Hydra009 on September 11, 2020, 01:46:31 PM
Here's the recap for that episode I'm working off of:

Sorry but you are not allowed to view spoiler contents.

Quite a lot of meat on the bones, in terms of plot.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: SGOS on September 11, 2020, 02:30:21 PM
That was a good recap.  I'll look for more from that guy.
Title: Re: Westworld TV Series
Post by: SGOS on September 13, 2020, 08:36:31 AM
Episode 5 makes way more sense with the spoilers from that recap, and was definitely enjoyable.  It's sort of like "cheating" to use spoilers, but I don't mind cheating in this case.