https://apnews.com/9d8e5e8e9245412ab80f5a1f58d885b7/Self-taught-rocket-scientist-plans-to-launch-over-ghost-town
QuoteHughes is a 61-year-old limo driver who’s spent the last few years building a steam-powered rocket out of salvage parts in his garage...His first test of the rocket will also be the launch date â€" Saturday , when he straps into his homemade contraption and attempts to hurtle over the ghost town of Amboy, California. He will travel about a mile at a speed of roughly 500 mph.
QuoteHe believes what he believes, including that the Earth is flat. He knows this thought is a conundrum, given that he’s about to launch himself into the atmosphere.
Quote“I don’t believe in science,†said Hughes, whose main sponsor for the rocket is Research Flat Earth. “I know about aerodynamics and fluid dynamics and how things move through the air, about the certain size of rocket nozzles, and thrust. But that’s not science, that’s just a formula.
Umm...no, rocket science is science. It's literally in the name. Specifically, it's physics and physics is a field of science.
QuoteThere’s no difference between science and science fiction.â€
Well, one is fictional. Again, the name is a pretty big clue.
QuoteFollowing his jump, he said he’s going to announce his plans to leap into the race for governor of California.
*facepalm*
"I don't believe in science." While building a rocket?
Good Grief!! When I first saw the headline, "This man is about to launch himself in his homemade rocket to prove the Earth is flat (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/speaking-of-science/wp/2017/11/21/this-man-is-about-to-launch-himself-in-his-homemade-rocket-to-prove-the-earth-is-flat/?utm_term=.1a85e8171449)", I thought that it must be a satirical piece. Evidently not.
Well, more power to him. According to the article that I read, he expects to reach an altitude of 1800ft, and surely from his personal observation at that altitude, he will probably surmise that the Earth is, indeed, flat. Rather than building his own rocket, I think that a more frugal expenditure of his research budget would be to hire a privately piloted small airplane, but then where is the fun and adventure in that.
If he survives the trip, perhaps he can go further into his quest for unscientific "knowledge" by mounting an expedition to the Earth's edge, and maybe even excavate down to one of the four pillars.
Quote from: Luther Martini on November 21, 2017, 02:57:17 PM
Good Grief!! When I first saw the headline, "This man is about to launch himself in his homemade rocket to prove the Earth is flat (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/speaking-of-science/wp/2017/11/21/this-man-is-about-to-launch-himself-in-his-homemade-rocket-to-prove-the-earth-is-flat/?utm_term=.1a85e8171449)", I thought that it must be a satirical piece. Evidently not.
Well, more power to him. According to the article that I read, he expects to reach an altitude of 1800ft, and surely from his personal observation at that altitude, he will probably surmise that the Earth is, indeed, flat. Rather than building his own rocket, I think that a more frugal expenditure of his research budget would be to hire a privately piloted small airplane, but then where is the fun and adventure in that.
If he survives the trip, perhaps he can go further into his quest for unscientific "knowledge" by mounting an expedition to the Earth's edge, and maybe even excavate down to one of the four pillars.
Even if the guy was allowed to be launched up to the international space station to look at the earth, he'd still say the earth is flat, a flat disk.
(http://i0.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/mobile/000/019/856/flat-earth.jpg)
because along with everything else in their heads, perspective one of the least controversial parts of their personalities.
Dear Flat-Earther Loons,
Your hypothesis of a flat Earth requires that your Earth has an edge. Find this edge, then we'll talk about the merits of your hypothesis.
-A Grumpy Miko
Quote from: Hakurei Reimu on November 21, 2017, 05:24:51 PM
Dear Flat-Earther Loons,
Your hypothesis of a flat Earth requires that your Earth has an edge. Find this edge, then we'll talk about the merits of your hypothesis.
-A Grumpy Miko
They got that covered. The Earth is surrounded by an ice wall (which looks suspiciously like the ice shelves at Antarctica) and nobody's ever climbed that wall, or flew over it, or anything like that, so we don't know what's beyond that insurmountable barrier-like thingy.
Andy Griffith already did this ...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHUWlEB6N1s
A reporter asked his character, why his rocket does't go fast like the ones from Nasa? He replied in "good old boy style" that ... he wasn't in no hurry ;-))
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on November 21, 2017, 06:09:24 PM
They got that covered. The Earth is surrounded by an ice wall (which looks suspiciously like the ice shelves at Antarctica) and nobody's ever climbed that wall, or flew over it, or anything like that, so we don't know what's beyond that insurmountable barrier-like thingy.
I wonder if they ever look at photos of Earth from space and wonder why these photos only show some continents - never all the continents all at once - and different continents at different times.
Also, how come different countries experience sunrise and sunset at different times and not all at once?
This flat earth stuff falls apart extremely easily just given basic facts about the world and a light application of logic.
Quote from: Hydra009 on November 21, 2017, 08:03:23 PM
I wonder if they ever look at photos of Earth from space and wonder why these photos only show some continents - never all the continents all at once - and different continents at different times.
Also, how come different countries experience sunrise and sunset at different times and not all at once?
This flat earth stuff falls apart extremely easily just given basic facts about the world and a light application of logic.
It's all part of the scam. Of course Big Space wants people to believe they "went into orbit"! They'd lose their funding if th truth got out.
As for the day-night thing, it's always daylight. You've been lied to your entire life.
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on November 21, 2017, 08:16:27 PMAs for the day-night thing, it's always daylight. You've been lied to your entire life.
(https://i.imgur.com/Q2kbSFj.gif)
Quote from: Hydra009 on November 21, 2017, 12:40:58 PM
https://apnews.com/9d8e5e8e9245412ab80f5a1f58d885b7/Self-taught-rocket-scientist-plans-to-launch-over-ghost-town
Umm...no, rocket science is science. It's literally in the name. Specifically, it's physics and physics is a field of science.
Well, one is fictional. Again, the name is a pretty big clue.
Following his jump, he said he’s going to announce his plans to leap into the race for governor of California.
*facepalm*
I was at Democratic dinner one time where all the Democratic candidates for one of Montana's senatorial seats showed up to speak and pitch themselves. They were your typical politicians, all experienced and well qualified, except for one guy who reminded me of your rocket man. The only qualification that he pitched was that he was a former alcoholic who had overcome his problem. I guess if you can do that, you are qualified to represent a state. In addition, he showed up wearing a clown outfit, big red round nose and all, and walked around holding the strings of about 25 helium balloons. He held onto them even during his speech. I dunno, maybe he was trying to make some kind of subtle statement about his opinion of politics, but he talked like he was super serious about his campaign. I don't recall if he actually showed up on the primary ballot or not.
(http://i0.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/mobile/000/019/856/flat-earth.jpg)
In looking at that map, the only thing I don't get is how Sara Palin could possibly see Russia from her house.
Quote from: SGOS on November 21, 2017, 10:04:32 PM
(http://i0.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/mobile/000/019/856/flat-earth.jpg)
In looking at that map, the only thing I don't get is how Sara Palin could possibly see Russia from her house.
Speaking of Alaska, how the hell are native Americans supposed to get from Asia to North America on that? Or Polynesians to Hawaii? Commodore Perry might've been in for one hell of a shock, too.
People like this should not reproduce and disappear
I'll support the "flat earth theory"....when I was in Iceland, working for the military, it was daylight 24 hours a day. All the better to see those hot ass Icelandic women.....
Quote from: bericks999 on November 21, 2017, 11:54:04 PM
I'll support the "flat earth theory"....when I was in Iceland, working for the military, it was daylight 24 hours a day. All the better to see those hot ass Icelandic women.....
<snare drum>
Quote from: SGOS on November 21, 2017, 09:58:13 PM
I was at Democratic dinner one time where all the Democratic candidates for one of Montana's senatorial seats showed up to speak and pitch themselves. They were your typical politicians, all experienced and well qualified, except for one guy who reminded me of your rocket man. The only qualification that he pitched was that he was a former alcoholic who had overcome his problem. I guess if you can do that, you are qualified to represent a state. In addition, he showed up wearing a clown outfit, big red round nose and all, and walked around holding the strings of about 25 helium balloons. He held onto them even during his speech. I dunno, maybe he was trying to make some kind of subtle statement about his opinion of politics, but he talked like he was super serious about his campaign. I don't recall if he actually showed up on the primary ballot or not.
Definitely my kind of candidate ... from Church of Dischordianism?
Someone Should give him a prize for his will and effort.
I'm pretty sure a Darwin a award will soon become an option.
Quote from: Mr.Obvious on November 22, 2017, 02:56:09 AM
Someone Should give him a prize for his will and effort.
I'm pretty sure a Darwin a award will soon become an option.
Not at 61 years old.
Steam generates a tremendous force, and would be a great way to power a rocket. Maybe not for interstellar travel, but plenty good enough for getting to the moon. And once out of the atmosphere were you can pollute without smudging up the air, you can boil the water using wood burners. We have lots of wood, and it would make a very cost effective rocket fuel.
Quote from: Hydra009 on November 21, 2017, 10:11:15 PM
Speaking of Alaska, how the hell are native Americans supposed to get from Asia to North America on that? Or Polynesians to Hawaii? Commodore Perry might've been in for one hell of a shock, too.
You just follow the edge of the disk. This is called the great circle route, and it's the shortest line of travel if you have to go more than forty miles. Otherwise a straight line works better.
Quote from: SGOS on November 22, 2017, 06:18:51 AM
Steam generates a tremendous force, and would be a great way to power a rocket. Maybe not for interstellar travel, but plenty good enough for getting to the moon. And once out of the atmosphere were you can pollute without smudging up the air, you can boil the water using wood burners. We have lots of wood, and it would make a very cost effective rocket fuel.
But it's very inefficient. You'd never lift the wood needed to get a steam rocket to the Moon. Highly compressed hydrogen would burn nicely, but the ancillary equipment would reduce that advantage.
(I was a Machinist Mate in the USN, working on steam turbines. We needed a three story high boiler to produce 70,000 hp.)
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on November 22, 2017, 07:08:03 AM
But it's very inefficient. You'd never lift the wood needed to get a steam rocket to the Moon. Highly compressed hydrogen would burn nicely, but the ancillary equipment would reduce that advantage.
(I was a Machinist Mate in the USN, working on steam turbines. We needed a three story high boiler to produce 70,000 hp.)
Ship engines are huge ... too bad you weren't limited to sails ;-)
Quote from: SGOS on November 22, 2017, 06:26:28 AM
You just follow the edge of the disk. This is called the great circle route, and it's the shortest line of travel if you have to go more than forty miles. Otherwise a straight line works better.
That constituted immediate proof of Earth as a sphere, but didn't get proven until early 19th century (by Gauss in Germany) ... by that time the survivors of Magellan's pleasure cruise had prove the point already. Gauss also hoped to prove Einstein's GTR ... 100 years early ... to prove or disprove the physical relevance of Euclid. But his instruments couldn't be sensitive enough. We now prove this in Earth orbit, for GPS.
Further exact surveying of the 19th century in British India, showed that something gravitational was throwing things off. This proved that the Himalaya mountains, had deep roots, causing the plumb bob to lean a little off vertical, toward those mountains. Charting the systematic error, was revealing. That or it was Shangri-La ;-)
Quote from: Mr.Obvious on November 22, 2017, 02:56:09 AM
Someone Should give him a prize for his will and effort.
I'm pretty sure a Darwin a award will soon become an option.
Darwin award indeed. When I first read the article, the story of this nitwit riding a home built rocket into the sky reminded me of a Darwin award from the past. Although the story was later debunked, the award was supposedly given to a man in Arizona who had attached a JATO (jet assisted take off) rocket to a car, and of course, ignited the rocket while driving said vehicle. As the story goes, the unrecognizable remains of the car were found by the highway patrol, embedded into the side of a mountain. Adding a bit of flair to the tale, one piece of the vehicle that did survive was a portion of the rear bumper, to which was affixed a bumper sticker that read "Don't like my driving ... call 1-800-EAT-SHIT".
Quote from: Luther Martini on November 22, 2017, 07:27:46 AM
Darwin award indeed. When I first read the article, the story of this nitwit riding a home built rocket into the sky reminded me of a Darwin award from the past. Although the story was later debunked, the award was supposedly given to a man in Arizona who had attached a JATO (jet assisted take off) rocket to a car, and of course, ignited the rocket while driving said vehicle. As the story goes, the unrecognizable remains of the car were found by the highway patrol, embedded into the side of a mountain. Adding a bit of flair to the tale, one piece of the vehicle that did survive was a portion of the rear bumper, to which was affixed a bumper sticker that read "Don't like my driving ... call 1-800-EAT-SHIT".
Yeah, that was the first Mythbusters episode.
However, the lunatics I hang out with are trying to build a pulse jet, like the used on the Buzz Bombs (V-1). They plan to mount it INSIDE a station wagon (estate car?). They are, of course, insane. That's why we're friends.
How high up does he hope to fly?
Amboy, eh? On old Route 66. Camped there once.
I expect he's going to be nothing more than a dark spot on the damp side of a canyon wall.
Quote from: Atheon on November 22, 2017, 01:41:05 PM
How high up does he hope to fly?
Amboy, eh? On old Route 66. Camped there once.
I expect he's going to be nothing more than a dark spot on the damp side of a canyon wall.
He's shooting for 1,800 feet, less than 550 meters. Quite enough to give him the proof he wants.
Quote from: Hydra009 on November 21, 2017, 08:03:23 PM
This flat earth stuff falls apart extremely easily just given basic facts about the world and a light application of logic.
Yep, same with the god stuff. But it doesn't seem to slow that crowd down much either.
1800 ft it not high enough to hit the glass ceiling, but its impressive for steam... unless you’re a shooter on an aircraft carrier.
We need to find out where the flat earthers get their stache, cause its good stuff.
Quote from: fencerider on November 23, 2017, 12:50:33 AM
1800 ft it not high enough to hit the glass ceiling, but its impressive for steam... unless you’re a shooter on an aircraft carrier.
"Sir, when you push that button the aircraft is going somewhere. I don't care where, my job is to make it go ... somewhere."
Quote
We need to find out where the flat earthers get their stache, cause its good stuff.
Maui.
Question: Which is the "official" flatter world map, the Mercator projection or the polar projection? If it's the Mercator Sarah Falin would never be able to see Russia from her back porch.
I think its polar. Antarctica is supposed to be 24,000 mile ring of ice that surrounds the earth. And supposedly all the recent presidents have been there so that they can see the glass dome contacting the earth with their own eyes.
I wonder how far we could get his little red and yellow rocket to go if we put it on the sled... maybe it would start cartwheeling down the runway
Quote from: fencerider on November 24, 2017, 02:37:48 AM
I wonder how far we could get his little red and yellow rocket to go if we put it on the sled... maybe it would start cartwheeling down the runway
The Nazi V-1 (Buzz Bomb) used a launch railing that was about ten times the length of the vehicle. His is about the same length as his kamikaze machine.
This is why I think most of these jackoffs are just pulling our chain. Here's a guy building a rocket in his backyard to prove the earth is flat. If he's got the aptitude to build such a thing, then he'd surely have to understand that there are places he could just get in his car and drive to that would give him a view of the horizon from much higher than 1800ft.
He'd also have to understand that for a couple hundred dollars, he could go to almost any local airport, take a flying lesson and get to at least double that altitude.
And finally he'd have to understand that if he honestly wanted to see with his own eyes once and for all whether or not the earth was curved, he can easily do ti with right amount of money. http://www.migflug.com/en/jet-fighter-flights/flying-with-a-jet/mig-29-edge-of-space.html?gclid=CjwKCAiAo9_QBRACEiwASknDwZl-nmlEu-NaJCO75PDgShpDI7b616_SMRccOk8ls6UIe2UqEAMlcRoCXpUQAvD_BwE (http://www.migflug.com/en/jet-fighter-flights/flying-with-a-jet/mig-29-edge-of-space.html?gclid=CjwKCAiAo9_QBRACEiwASknDwZl-nmlEu-NaJCO75PDgShpDI7b616_SMRccOk8ls6UIe2UqEAMlcRoCXpUQAvD_BwE)
Pay your fee, strap in and you can ride a Mig29 to the edge of space and see with your own eyes if the earth curves or if its flat. No having to wonder about weird camera lens effects or anything like that, just your own two eyes. It'd be here we are in level flight at 1800ft and the horizon doesn't appear to have much curve to it. Just a little, but not very much at all. Then here we are at 18,000ft and there's slightly more curve visible, but still not all that much, could just be a big hill for all I know. Then here we are 49,000ft and yep, its definitely curved well that settles that I guess.
And that's the thing. For a price, a fairly large price but a price non the less, anyone can strap into the back seat of a Mig29 and go to the edge of space. So if these jack wagons really wanted to see for themselves that the planet is not flat, they could. But they don't do that because they know it would prevent them from being able to continue believing what they believe.
Which leads me to believe that most in the flat earth crowd actually have some sort of psychosis going on. Its not just stupidity, they've got some kind of diagnosable pathology happening in their heads. Which is a very polite way of saying they're crazy as a coconut.
It is easy to pull someone's chain. You just have to know what button to push. And mental health simply isn't the norm ... mere conformance to majority opinion, isn't conformance to truth. To paraphrase Einstein ... common sense is the sum of all prejudice you accumulate before you are 20. Some of us, live in a more enlightened age. But what good does it do you?
Quote from: Johan on November 24, 2017, 01:20:55 PMAnd that's the thing. For a price, a fairly large price but a price non the less, anyone can strap into the back seat of a Mig29 and go to the edge of space. So if these jack wagons really wanted to see for themselves that the planet is not flat, they could. But they don't do that because they know it would prevent them from being able to continue believing what they believe.
Which leads me to believe that most in the flat earth crowd actually have some sort of psychosis going on. Its not just stupidity, they've got some kind of diagnosable pathology happening in their heads. Which is a very polite way of saying they're crazy as a coconut.
I dunno about it being mental illness, but there's definitely a lack of genuine scientific curiosity. This stuff is easy as hell to figure out. FFS, the Greeks figured it out in an age when the common people believed in witchcraft. As you say, there's a bunch of easy, inexpensive ways to find out for yourself. I've suggested a few, too.
Hell, you could piece it together with photos of Earth alone. *holds photo of the Americas and Europe* *holds photo of Europe, Africa, and Asia* *holds photo of Asia and the Americas* Hmm...I wonder how this is possible...
Suffice it to say that these people are not particularly interested in science, even on a layman's level like me. Rather, it appears like a few cranks got together through the power of the internet, formed a community, reinforced each other's pseudoscientific beliefs, and took to the internet to spread their ideas across the globe.
Their ideas aren't spreading because they're good, far from it. They spread because their ideas attract a ton of attention (and here I am, giving their craved attention) and because this stuff serves to make stupid people feel like they've figured out some great truth about the universe hidden to everyone else - pseudoscience makes dumb people feel good. Add in the public distrust of actual experts and a postmodern approach to truth (facts are opinions and reality is subjective), and you have the toxic brew that a bunch of pseudoscience springs from.
TL;DR: Not necessarily pathological, just an ideology a hundred cognitive missteps in the making.
Quote from: Hydra009 on November 24, 2017, 08:32:10 PM
you could piece it together with photos of Earth alone. *holds photo of the Americas and Europe* *holds photo of Europe, Africa, and Asia* *holds photo of Asia and the Americas* Hmm...I wonder how this is possible....
NOAA weather satelites make a continuous scan line a couple miles tall and 200-300 miles wide. They balanced the rotation of the satelite with its orbital speed so that it makes a continous pic. If there was a way to capture the signal 24hrs/day you could make your pics
Quote from: Hydra009 on November 24, 2017, 08:32:10 PM
Their ideas aren't spreading because they're good, far from it. They spread because their ideas attract a ton of attention (and here I am, giving their craved attention) and because this stuff serves to make stupid people feel like they've figured out some great truth about the universe hidden to everyone else - pseudoscience makes dumb people feel good. Add in the public distrust of actual experts and a postmodern approach to truth (facts are opinions and reality is subjective), and you have the toxic brew that a bunch of pseudoscience springs from.
You are really the great grand son of the lost prince of Morroco ;-)
Quote from: Hydra009 on November 24, 2017, 08:32:10 PM
TL;DR: Not necessarily pathological, just an ideology a hundred cognitive missteps in the making.
Presuppose that religion is right and science is wrong and then try to prove it
Quote from: fencerider on November 25, 2017, 01:30:18 PMNOAA weather satelites make a continuous scan line a couple miles tall and 200-300 miles wide. They balanced the rotation of the satelite with its orbital speed so that it makes a continous pic. If there was a way to capture the signal 24hrs/day you could make your pics
I never mentioned the NOAA weather satellites. In fact, I had another vantage point in mind.
(https://images.techhive.com/images/idge/imported/article/ctw/2010/02/17/nasa_hires_sharon-100396503-orig.jpg)
But regardless, all photos capture only a portion of the Earth's surface and none capture an edge. It doesn't take a genius to figure out what shape is most consistent with the data.
QuoteYou are really the great grand son of the lost prince of Morroco ;-)
Merchant of Venice reference? Or some obscure reference that I'm supposed to get?
QuotePresuppose that religion is right and science is wrong and then try to prove it
Some are that way. Some aren't. Even the super evangelical folks generally shy away from that stuff.
The flat-earth argument is too moronic to be seriously considered by other than, well, morons.
Satellites, moon-landings, pictures of Earth from space, ships disappearing over the horizon keel-to-mast, curved shadows on the the moon in lunar eclipses, etc... How could any rational person ignore that?
I assume they just do it as a joke.
Well, Dipshit has put his launch on hold. The Bureau of Land Management told him, no, not on our land you don't (https://gizmodo.com/flat-earth-researcher-told-he-cant-blast-himself-into-t-1820735736). So he's looking for another launch site. He's hoping to go up Tuesday.
Quote from: trdsf on November 26, 2017, 04:26:02 AM
Well, Dipshit has put his launch on hold. The Bureau of Land Management told him, no, not on our land you don't (https://gizmodo.com/flat-earth-researcher-told-he-cant-blast-himself-into-t-1820735736). So he's looking for another launch site. He's hoping to go up Tuesday.
The Civil Service is starting to fight back against the Orange Haired "Moron".
I figure Flat Earthers are just one form of narcissists; they crave the attention their stupidity gives them, and if they believe they are correct because they are "special" and have the world figured out while the masses, the experts, everyone else all live in their sad little stupidity and cant grasp the knowledge they have.
Sort of like basically all other conspiracy theories.
Quote...but as the Post noted, he’s only recently become a Flat Earth convert “after struggling for months to raise funds.†Hence the “RESEARCH FLAT EARTH†slogan on the side of his rocket...
Well, he's not a conspiracy nut then, just an idiot who needed some funding from idiots for his idoticness.
Quote from: Shiranu on November 26, 2017, 05:01:53 AM
Well, he's not a conspiracy nut then, just an idiot who needed some funding from idiots for his idoticness.
There are people whose opinions can be bought with funding. Lobbyists, politicians, and some TV hosts... More usually on the Right, as the Left types seem to be more rational
Quote from: Shiranu on November 26, 2017, 05:01:53 AM
Well, he's not a conspiracy nut then, just an idiot who needed some funding from idiots for his idoticness.
He presented himself as "live reality TV show", obviously trolling for sponsors.
Quote from: Hydra009 on November 24, 2017, 08:32:10 PM
TL;DR: Not necessarily pathological, just an ideology a hundred cognitive missteps in the making.
I'm still going with some sort of diagnosable pathology being involved. Not saying they're dangerous or bad people. Just that they a particular type of bad wiring which causes them to need to latch on to this bizarre belief.
As a side note. With the increasing amount of press this movement seems to be gaining, and with the seemingly limitless potential for douche bags to be, well douche bags, I'm waiting for the plastic surgery billboard we all know is coming. "The earth might be flat, but that doesn't mean it has to stay that way... Saul Spiegelman Affordable Breast Enhancement"
Quote from: Cavebear on November 26, 2017, 04:55:51 AM
The Civil Service is starting to fight back against the Orange Haired "Moron".
Spoils system. Not just 4,500 political appointees. Fire all the Democrats in government ;-) They are Jefferson Davis/Karl Marx traitors ;-))
Maybe he should just stick to the anti-gravity effects of cavity structures, like this guy:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V77S5R1C4yg
Anti-gravity is easy according to Feynman ... it is called a chair.
Quote from: Baruch on November 26, 2017, 11:37:45 AM
Spoils system. Not just 4,500 political appointees. Fire all the Democrats in government ;-) They are Jefferson Davis/Karl Marx traitors ;-))
The political parties are not what they were originally. The Republicans are no longer the party of Lincoln and the Democrats are no longer the party of the Southern Confederates. They have slowly switched, though Nixon made the change politically successful.
Quote from: Cavebear on December 02, 2017, 04:07:45 AM
The political parties are not what they were originally. The Republicans are no longer the party of Lincoln and the Democrats are no longer the party of the Southern Confederates. They have slowly switched, though Nixon made the change politically successful.
Don't confuse the younger people with mere history ;-)
Quote from: Baruch on December 02, 2017, 08:03:35 AM
Don't confuse the younger people with mere history ;-)
Of course not. You merely want YOU to confuse them. I won't grant you Pacific Ave, North Carolina Ave, and Pennsylvania Ave.
Quote from: Cavebear on December 09, 2017, 06:23:07 AM
Of course not. You merely want YOU to confuse them. I won't grant you Pacific Ave, North Carolina Ave, and Pennsylvania Ave.
Smile, when you land on my hotel on Park Place!
Quote from: Baruch on December 09, 2017, 09:58:09 AM
Smile, when you land on my hotel on Park Place!
Odds say the 4th street greens beat the blues with hotels. Getting to the hotels is a separate matter...