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Science Section => Science General Discussion => Topic started by: Solitary on June 15, 2013, 12:58:56 AM

Title: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Solitary on June 15, 2013, 12:58:56 AM
:evil:
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Johan on June 15, 2013, 07:21:44 AM
I'd rather have that 48 minutes of my life back.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: stromboli on June 15, 2013, 07:25:50 AM
tl;dr. Oblivion.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Rajhoul on June 15, 2013, 09:35:18 PM
Quote from: "Johan"
I'd rather have that 48 minutes of my life back.

As if you actually watched any of it.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Rajhoul on June 15, 2013, 09:52:32 PM
No worries Solitary, one day the capitalistic dominant controlled media will have to adress and confront The Zeitgeist Movement and along with it The Venus Project and many more people will begin to realize that the greatest destroyer of ecology the greatest source of waste, depletion and pollution the greatest purveyor of violence,war, crime, poverty, animal abuse and inhumanity, the greatest generator of social and personal neurosis, mental disorders, depression, anxiety not to mention, the greatest source of social paralysis stopping us from moving into new methodologies for personal health, global sustainability and progress on this planet is not some corrupt government or legislation not some rogue corporation or banking cartel not some flaw of human nature and not some secret hidden cabal that controls the world.

It is, in fact: The Socio-Economic System itself at its very foundation.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Colanth on June 15, 2013, 09:53:54 PM
It's Utopian.  The only problem with Utopianism is the people.  We'd need to redesign the species in order for it to work.  Otherwise, it's a great idea.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: aitm on June 15, 2013, 09:57:05 PM
the problem with humanity is people
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Solitary on June 16, 2013, 12:09:28 AM
:evil:
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Plu on June 17, 2013, 05:35:20 AM
Quote
It is, in fact: The Socio-Economic System itself at its very foundation.

It's just greed. It's the basic thing that destroys all attempts to make a world suitable for everyone. The inhabitants don't give a fuck about "everyone".
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Rajhoul on June 17, 2013, 10:58:08 AM
Quote from: "Solitary"
If everyone was as intelligent as Tesla, Einstein, Hawking, Feynman, Bertrand Russell, and other great scientist, I think it would work, however, we as humans, for the most part, love competition to the point of bringing out the worst in people. So I don't think it will ever happen. And as resources dwindle and the population keeps growing we will come to a point we will be competing just to get a drink of water, if a third world war doesn't kill almost every life form accept bacteria's and viruses. And any humans that did survive would be fighting with stick and stones while a shaman preys for them.  :cry:  Solitary

Quote
Disciples of the Monetary-Market religion, the Self-Appointed Guardians of the Status Quo constantly seek out ways to avoid any form of thought which might interfere with their beliefs. The most common of which are Projected Dualities. If you're not a Republican, you must be a Democrat. If you are not Christian, you might be a Satanist and if you feel society can be greatly improved to consider, perhaps - I don't know- taking care of everyone? You're just a “ God Damned Utopianist”. And the most insidious of them all: if you are not for the "free-market" you must be against freedom itself.

-Peter Joseph
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Plu on June 17, 2013, 11:21:16 AM
While it sounds good in theory to take care of everyone, greed will take over. We already have people on welfare that refuse to work and just hold up their hand. Many have a criminal carreer on the side for extra income.

That'll only get worse.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Solitary on June 17, 2013, 11:28:31 AM
:evil:
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: josephpalazzo on June 17, 2013, 02:38:51 PM
Quote from: "aitm"
the problem with humanity is people

You're such a dog.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Rajhoul on June 17, 2013, 02:44:33 PM
Quote from: "Colanth"
It's Utopian.  The only problem with Utopianism is the people.  We'd need to redesign the species in order for it to work.  Otherwise, it's a great idea.


This kind of thinking irks me because of how self-defeating it is.

The status quo perpertuates more easily due to lack of education of any other way of allocating resources or societal sustainability, than it perpetuates itself based on some non peer-reviwed made up belief that only a new genetic organism can exist in a altruistic world.

Or to put in another way as Gabor Mate said:

Quote
It's simply a matter of historical fact that the dominant intellectual culture of any particular society reflects the interests of the dominant group in that society. In a slave owning society the beliefs about human beings and human rights and so on will reflect the needs of the slave owners. In the society, which again is based on the power of certain people to control and profit from the lives and work of millions of others the dominant intellectual culture will reflect the needs of the dominant group. So, if you look across the board, the ideas that pervade psychology and sociology and history and political economy and political science fundamentally reflect certain elite interests. And the academics who question that too much tend to get shunted to the side or to be seen as sort of “radicals”.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Rajhoul on June 17, 2013, 02:57:53 PM
Even worse is when it is mentioned time and time again about how assassinations, coup d'etats, and a major coverup or two, maintains the established dominant power-base, thus paralyzing any thought that is not the norm.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Plu on June 17, 2013, 03:00:29 PM
One of the big problems we face is that the very thing that gives us progress is the thing we're trying to change. We improve as a society because we constantly seek to improve ourselves, do things better, faster, cheaper. But it's also the reason we screw each other up.

Changing the game so that we are no longer rewarded for excelling, while allowing us to create a better society, would also most likely stifle our ability to move forward.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Rajhoul on June 17, 2013, 10:54:16 PM
"Americans have been conditioned in their kind of society to get a new kind of car next year, to buy, a new television set or a new tape recorder.

We are radical as hell but our political and social institutions have not changed and this is where we are stagnating.

 It must be a privilege to serve members of society. Not that we want rewards or medals or honor for what we do, because it is just an honor to do it. And if you cannot work for that, then you missed the boat. You don't understand the teachings of the wisest men that ever lived."-Jacque Fresco in 1974.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Plu on June 18, 2013, 01:57:28 AM
It's cute to come up with quotes, but they don't solve the actual problem. You're saying the exact same thing I am, except you somehow seem to think you're helping your own case with it.

Wishful thinking doesn't change reality. Pretty quotes don't change human nature.

In fact, if you want to go and do something about this problem, here's a quote for you.

Quote
“If we could change ourselves, the tendencies in the world would also change. As a man changes his own nature, so does the attitude of the world change towards him. … We need not wait to see what others do.”

Lead by example.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: DunkleSeele on June 18, 2013, 08:57:51 AM
I clicked the link. I saw "Venus Project". I closed it.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Rajhoul on June 18, 2013, 05:53:30 PM
Quote from: "Plu"
It's cute to come up with quotes, but they don't solve the actual problem. You're saying the exact same thing I am, except you somehow seem to think you're helping your own case with it.

Wishful thinking doesn't change reality. Pretty quotes don't change human nature.

In fact, if you want to go and do something about this problem, here's a quote for you.

Quote
“If we could change ourselves, the tendencies in the world would also change. As a man changes his own nature, so does the attitude of the world change towards him. … We need not wait to see what others do.”

Lead by example.


Quote
Jiddu Krishnamurti: We were saying how very important it is to bring about, in the human mind, the radical revolution. The crisis is a crisis in consciousness, the crisis that cannot anymore accept the old norms, the old patterns, the ancient traditions and considering what the world is now, with all the misery, conflict, destructive brutality, aggression and so on. Man is still as he was, is still brutal, violent, aggressive, acquisitive, competitive and... he has built a society along these lines.

Quote
Jiddu Krishnamurti: What we are trying in all these discussions and talks here, is to see if we cannot radically bring about a transformation of the mind. *Not accept things as they are* - but to understand it, to go into it, examine it, give your heart and your mind with every thing that you have to find out. A way of living differently. But that depends on you and not somebody else. Because in this there is no teacher, no pupil. There's no leader, there is no guru, there's no master, no savior. You yourself are the teacher, and the pupil, you're the master, you're the guru, you are the leader, you are everything! And, to understand is to transform what is.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Rajhoul on June 18, 2013, 05:54:25 PM
Quote from: "DunkleSeele"
I clicked the link. I saw "Venus Project". I closed it.

Cretin.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Plu on June 18, 2013, 06:10:51 PM
Well, you're free to keep talking and not accomplish anything if that makes you happier, I guess.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Rajhoul on June 18, 2013, 06:24:52 PM
Quote from: "Plu"
Well, you're free to keep talking and not accomplish anything if that makes you happier, I guess.

You won't change much either to do so is to bite the hand that feeds you.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Plu on June 19, 2013, 03:19:35 AM
I'm not trying to change anything, though. So I'm meeting my goals, and you are not.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: DunkleSeele on June 19, 2013, 03:26:08 AM
Quote from: "Rajhoul"
Quote from: "DunkleSeele"
I clicked the link. I saw "Venus Project". I closed it.

Cretin.
Says the one who believes in a glorified version of communism with only slightly nicer housing and is clearly uncapable of own thoughts.

Come back to us when you're capable to post something other than someone else's quotes. I won't hold my breath, mind you.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Rajhoul on June 19, 2013, 09:59:40 PM
Yes, except I posses the knowledge and thus can spead this info, you will not.

Don't forget The Zeitgeist Movement either, cretins.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Rajhoul on June 19, 2013, 10:08:59 PM
http://https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vWEdhg002-o

 Zeitgeist moving forward: beyond the pale
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Rajhoul on June 19, 2013, 10:11:41 PM
Quote
with only slightly nicer housing

I guess someone isn't going to like Dante Bini, or any other architect person who built something other than the norm.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Rajhoul on June 20, 2013, 03:25:17 AM
In the future machine automation will end the labor for income system.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Plu on June 20, 2013, 03:28:30 AM
Quote from: "Rajhoul"
In the future machine automation will end the labor for income system.

Yeah, I'm hard at work making workers obsolete actually :)

That's going to be interesting, when we run out of jobs that can be done by any moron and only have high-tech jobs left. It's not going to be pretty for a lot of people.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Rajhoul on June 22, 2013, 07:14:58 AM
Thank to our monetary system most people can't afford high tech jobs much less anything else.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Plu on June 22, 2013, 10:10:32 AM
I know :) That's the interesting part. We'll either need to get rid of the monetary system, get rid of most of the population, get rid of current society, or do something even more drastic.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Rajhoul on July 06, 2013, 03:58:34 AM
Abolishing money isn't drastic, it's rational.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Aupmanyav on July 09, 2013, 08:53:25 AM
Quote from: "Rajhoul"
Quote
Jiddu Krishnamurti:
A glib talker who did nothing else.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Plu on July 09, 2013, 09:24:38 AM
Quote from: "Rajhoul"
Abolishing money isn't drastic, it's rational.

These are not opposites. Something can easily be both. "drastic" just means extreme, severe or radical. Considering the level of impact abolishing money would have on the world, the term certainly qualifies.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Seabear on July 09, 2013, 09:31:20 AM
Quote from: "Solitary"
If everyone was as intelligent as Tesla, Einstein, Hawking, Feynman, Bertrand Russell, and other great scientist, I think it would work,
You must be joking. A lot of people with huge intellects have huge egos to go right along with them. Some are complete social retards. Genius is no guarantee that they can play nicely with others.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Rajhoul on July 09, 2013, 09:45:01 AM
Quote from: "Plu"
Quote from: "Rajhoul"
Abolishing money isn't drastic, it's rational.

These are not opposites. Something can easily be both. "drastic" just means extreme, severe or radical. Considering the level of impact abolishing money would have on the world, the term certainly qualifies.


Humanity could adapt.
Title: Re: What Would You Rather Have Or Oblivian?
Post by: Plu on July 09, 2013, 09:49:03 AM
Well, yeah. If we couldn't adapt, it's wouldn't be drastic, it'd be catastrophic.