Pat Condell says what we are only thinking.
How is he not hunted down yet?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ydPZRoLzu-E
Europe is killing itself? About time!
Quote from: Baruch on November 11, 2017, 11:16:00 AM
Europe is killing itself? About time!
Europe is going through some major political adjustments, and much of it is our fault. Yes, the decisions are theirs, but we could have helped them stay together if we (the US) had tried more. And it wouldn't have taken much effort. We failed our allies.
Quote from: Cavebear on November 11, 2017, 11:25:45 AM
Europe is going through some major political adjustments, and much of it is our fault. Yes, the decisions are theirs, but we could have helped them stay together if we (the US) had tried more. And it wouldn't have taken much effort. We failed our allies.
You may be right. The American-English couple couldn't share the same flat with the German-French couple. It wasn't just an Odd Couple, it was a marriage made in the hell of WW II. And those Slavic neighbors, one street over .. playing their Polka way too loud!
Can I watch?
Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk
QuoteHow is he not hunted down yet?
Maybe because those scary leftist monsters under your bed are all in your head.
Quote from: Shiranu on November 13, 2017, 10:45:14 AM
Maybe because those scary leftist monsters under your bed are all in your head.
WW II was fake news. Churchill was the bad guy. See Pat Buchanan writings.
Quote from: Cavebear on November 11, 2017, 11:25:45 AM
Europe is going through some major political adjustments, and much of it is our fault. Yes, the decisions are theirs, but we could have helped them stay together if we (the US) had tried more. And it wouldn't have taken much effort. We failed our allies.
How exactly would you have kept us (Europe) together, I wonder?
I don't mean to be hostile about this, but I really don't see what the US could have deliberately done or could now deliberatly do, to keep the European Union afloat. I'm not saying Europe and the US are two islands; seperated and not influencing one another. But not everything in the world is in control of the US.
I know this might be a dumb analogy, but I feel like it would be if I said we Europeans failed our American allies by letting them ellect Trump as a president. We could have helped them make a better choice, and it wouldn't have taken much effort.
Quote from: Mr.Obvious on November 13, 2017, 06:59:54 PM
How exactly would you have kept us (Europe) together, I wonder?
I don't mean to be hostile about this, but I really don't see what the US could have deliberately done or could now deliberatly do, to keep the European Union afloat. I'm not saying Europe and the US are two islands; seperated and not influencing one another. But not everything in the world is in control of the US.
I know this might be a dumb analogy, but I feel like it would be if I said we Europeans failed our American allies by letting them ellect Trump as a president. We could have helped them make a better choice, and it wouldn't have taken much effort.
Make trillion dollar platinum coins, but small ones, and hand them out to the Europeans gratis. Then if a European wants to buy India or China, they can do so, if they can find a seller. Marshall plan only exponentially greater. See, people live at peace, if they have small expectations and are content. If they have big expectations, or are discontented, then nothing will satisfy them. People on Pacific islands, where the population wasn't too large, and they didn't know about the West ... they were content. That is impossible anywhere now. Everyone on Earth must become a Kardashian. Communication has made education easier, but leaves everyone unhappy about their material condition.
Quote from: Baruch on November 13, 2017, 07:24:28 PM
Make trillion dollar platinum coins, but small ones, and hand them out to the Europeans gratis. Then if a European wants to buy India or China, they can do so, if they can find a seller. Marshall plan only exponentially greater. See, people live at peace, if they have small expectations and are content. If they have big expectations, or are discontented, then nothing will satisfy them. People on Pacific islands, where the population wasn't too large, and they didn't know about the West ... they were content. That is impossible anywhere now. Everyone on Earth must become a Kardashian. Communication has made education easier, but leaves everyone unhappy about their material condition.
... Yeah... Think I'm... Think I'm gonna wait... for Cavebear's reply there...
Thanks for the input though ;)
Oh let's see..The middle east has been rather close by to Europe for, oh, I don't know...forever? It's not like Europe has EVER meddled in the Middle East's affairs..oh no, never. The US kind of has sort of fucked with them as well, but heck. We have the Atlantic ocean in the way while you don't.
Sounds like a fucking tough luck story.. Here's an idea..Get an entire ocean between you and them! Sorry, you pissed that chance away around 250 years ago and some change..
Well, better luck next time you decide to find a new world.
GOD DAMNED! Empire building is HARD! And the people you fuck with for centuries just don't appreciate it..fucking ingrates..
Quote from: Mr.Obvious on November 13, 2017, 07:27:36 PM
... Yeah... Think I'm... Think I'm gonna wait... for Cavebear's reply there...
Thanks for the input though ;)
Well we can only recommend what we know. Europeans need to move to the US, get a job in government, and stay until they retire rich as Croesus. But he may have other ideas, that don't correspond to his personal experience. And I am not against government workers. I just don't see an American having any useful input.
Quote from: AllPurposeAtheist on November 13, 2017, 09:30:48 PM
Oh let's see..The middle east has been rather close by to Europe for, oh, I don't know...forever? It's not like Europe has EVER meddled in the Middle East's affairs..oh no, never. The US kind of has sort of fucked with them as well, but heck. We have the Atlantic ocean in the way while you don't.
Sounds like a fucking tough luck story.. Here's an idea..Get an entire ocean between you and them! Sorry, you pissed that chance away around 250 years ago and some change..
Well, better luck next time you decide to find a new world.
GOD DAMNED! Empire building is HARD! And the people you fuck with for centuries just don't appreciate it..fucking ingrates..
Yes, unlike the Americans, the Europeans weren't as good at genocide. And yes, a great many Europeans migrated centuries ago, to get away from European monarchy, and Muslim neighbors. Would you please take a dozen in your place? But only if they were born in Europe.
Quote from: Baruch on November 13, 2017, 09:51:55 PM
Yes, unlike the Americans, the Europeans weren't as good at genocide. And yes, a great many Europeans migrated centuries ago, to get away from European monarchy, and Muslim neighbors. Would you please take a dozen in your place? But only if they were born in Europe.
Not good at genocide? World War 2 seemed to contradict that.. I'd say European genocide was a roaring success in the 30s and 40s and seems to be gaining new popularity in certain circles.
Belgium and the Congo, Russia and the Russians also were some A+, over-achieving genocides.
For genocides I'd put the tobacco industry in the top ten.
Quote from: Shiranu on November 14, 2017, 07:21:42 AM
Belgium and the Congo, Russia and the Russians also were some A+, over-achieving genocides.
Then why do 3rd world nations still exist? Why aren't they just reservations inside Mega Britain, Mega Belgium? Russia is Mega already .. can't count them.
It is hard to commit genocide, if you value slave labor too highly.
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on November 14, 2017, 07:58:22 AM
For genocides I'd put the tobacco industry in the top ten.
America's original killing fields. In the Caribbean .. it was sugar cane/rum.
If Europe kills itself we can dust off the swords of manifest destiny and once more expand the American Empire. Of course the ships we built for American exceptionalism are still around to carry us to our French and English colonies ;-)
Quote from: Mr.Obvious on November 13, 2017, 06:59:54 PM
How exactly would you have kept us (Europe) together, I wonder?
I don't mean to be hostile about this, but I really don't see what the US could have deliberately done or could now deliberatly do, to keep the European Union afloat. I'm not saying Europe and the US are two islands; seperated and not influencing one another. But not everything in the world is in control of the US.
I know this might be a dumb analogy, but I feel like it would be if I said we Europeans failed our American allies by letting them ellect Trump as a president. We could have helped them make a better choice, and it wouldn't have taken much effort.
Not everything is in the control of the US. But the US could have spoken up more in support on the European Union, put some incentives out for England to stay there, and supported a more unified Europe.
Brexit caught us at a bad time.
I think the Unification of Europe and the continued alliance of Europe and the US was a good thing and England leaving it is a diminishment of that. Which will slowly lead to a gain for autocracies elsewhere in the world.
Trumpism will make things only worse.
PESCO and a Brief Look at the Machinations of the EU Neo-Fascist State (http://gatesofvienna.net/2017/11/pesco-and-a-brief-look-at-the-machinations-of-the-eu-neo-fascist-state/)
(http://gatesofvienna.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/seneca-pesco10.jpg)
Quote from: Cavebear on November 15, 2017, 01:46:26 AM
Not everything is in the control of the US. But the US could have spoken up more in support on the European Union, put some incentives out for England to stay there, and supported a more unified Europe.
Brexit caught us at a bad time.
I think the Unification of Europe and the continued alliance of Europe and the US was a good thing and England leaving it is a diminishment of that. Which will slowly lead to a gain for autocracies elsewhere in the world.
Trumpism will make things only worse.
You probably still support the League of Nations too ;-) We don't need kings and popes. Screw Europe (said by a recent American diplomat).
Quote from: pr126 on November 15, 2017, 02:02:48 AM
PESCO and a Brief Look at the Machinations of the EU Neo-Fascist State (http://gatesofvienna.net/2017/11/pesco-and-a-brief-look-at-the-machinations-of-the-eu-neo-fascist-state/)
(http://gatesofvienna.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/seneca-pesco10.jpg)
But ... but ... y'all like unelected monarchy, un-representative EU commission (European parliament is the Central Committee rubber stamp). And only cardinals get to vote for the Pope. Y'all are just serfs.
Quote from: Baruch on November 15, 2017, 02:14:04 AM
But ... but ... y'all like unelected monarchy, un-representative EU commission (European parliament is the Central Committee rubber stamp). And only cardinals get to vote for the Pope. Y'all are just serfs.
I previously stated that I was not fond of monarchies, and that I was in general favor of international cooperatism in matters of trade disputes and intellectual property ownership. China has to be forced into international legalism.
Quote from: Cavebear on November 15, 2017, 02:19:56 AM
I previously stated that I was not fond of monarchies, and that I was in general favor of international cooperatism in matters of trade disputes and intellectual property ownership. China has to be forced into international legalism.
Enjoy your stale rice bowl, while bicycling to your party meeting wearing a Mao jacket. Good stuff if for China now, and we need the Great Leap Forward of the SJW.
Quote from: Baruch on November 15, 2017, 02:22:40 AM
Enjoy your stale rice bowl, while bicycling to your party meeting wearing a Mao jacket. Good stuff if for China now, and we need the Great Leap Forward of the SJW.
I am not Maoist and you know it. I liked you better a few days ago when you were just a crazed alt-rightist and honest about it... As to riding a bicycle...
Quote from: Cavebear on November 15, 2017, 01:46:26 AM
Not everything is in the control of the US. But the US could have spoken up more in support on the European Union, put some incentives out for England to stay there, and supported a more unified Europe.
Brexit caught us at a bad time.
I think the Unification of Europe and the continued alliance of Europe and the US was a good thing and England leaving it is a diminishment of that. Which will slowly lead to a gain for autocracies elsewhere in the world.
Trumpism will make things only worse.
The UK had plenty of incentives to stay though. Offered by the European Union. The US jumping in there and offering to pitch in, while a good idea at heart, would cause an unfair an prefereable treatment of one nation, GB, versus the rest. Or would you also give incentives the moment France or Germany or Portugal decide to call it quits? You'd be opening a can of worms there.
The European Union is a whole greater than the sum of its parts. And if one nation doesn't believe in that, that's a sad fact. And its departure will weaken all. But any incentives must come from within the Union. The benefit must be being part of the Union. Otherwise, they'd be right in wanting to leave the Union.
I don't think external incentives would have even worked that well for Brittain. I don't think their reasons were 'logical' to begin with.
Quote from: Mr.Obvious on November 15, 2017, 03:42:10 AM
The UK had plenty of incentives to stay though. Offered by the European Union. The US jumping in there and offering to pitch in, while a good idea at heart, would cause an unfair an prefereable treatment of one nation, GB, versus the rest. Or would you also give incentives the moment France or Germany or Portugal decide to call it quits? You'd be opening a can of worms there.
The European Union is a whole greater than the sum of its parts. And if one nation doesn't believe in that, that's a sad fact. And its departure will weaken all. But any incentives must come from within the Union. The benefit must be being part of the Union. Otherwise, they'd be right in wanting to leave the Union.
I don't think external incentives would have even worked that well for Brittain. I don't think their reasons were 'logical' to begin with.
I understand. But it seems the beginning of the breakdown of the Western Democracy Alliance. And that matters.
I am against handing over sovereignty to a bunch of unelected bureaucrats and paying my taxes as tribute to the same.
The EU as it is run today, will fail. It is anti democratic, and becoming a totalitarian hegemony.
Aspirations to re-create the Roman Empire With Merkel as the new Caesar.
Third time lucky? Germany had already 2 attempts (WWI + WWII).
Quote from: pr126 on November 15, 2017, 05:13:11 AM
I am against handing over sovereignty to a bunch of unelected bureaucrats and paying my taxes as tribute to the same.
The EU as it is run today, will fail. It is anti democratic, and becoming a totalitarian hegemony.
Europe may or may not become totalitarian. They may become anti-democratic. But they will probably never become a hegemony again. Hegemony tends to follow trade connection patterns, and Europe isn't going to become THAT again unless the world needs some element or mineral they have that isn't currently valuable.
Quote from: Cavebear on November 15, 2017, 04:18:47 AM
I understand. But it seems the beginning of the breakdown of the Western Democracy Alliance. And that matters.
Should have ended in 1991. Let the Russians occupy Paris Disneyland.
Quote from: pr126 on November 15, 2017, 05:13:11 AM
I am against handing over sovereignty to a bunch of unelected bureaucrats and paying my taxes as tribute to the same.
The EU as it is run today, will fail. It is anti democratic, and becoming a totalitarian hegemony.
Aspirations to re-create the Roman Empire With Merkel as the new Caesar.
Third time lucky? Germany had already 2 attempts (WWI + WWII).
You just need to be bitch slapped by a well muscled butch dominatrix, until you like it.
Quote from: Cavebear on November 15, 2017, 05:20:21 AM
Europe may or may not become totalitarian. They may become anti-democratic. But they will probably never become a hegemony again. Hegemony tends to follow trade connection patterns, and Europe isn't going to become THAT again unless the world needs some element or mineral they have that isn't currently valuable.
Totalitarian? Already happened in 1992. Anti-democratic? Already happened in 1992. But yes, hegemony belongs to Russia and China. Hope they enjoy it.
Quote from: Baruch on November 15, 2017, 07:46:27 PM
You just need to be bitch slapped by a well muscled butch dominatrix, until you like it.
Remember, The safe word is 'brexit'.
Quote from: pr126 on November 15, 2017, 02:02:48 AM
PESCO and a Brief Look at the Machinations of the EU Neo-Fascist State (http://gatesofvienna.net/2017/11/pesco-and-a-brief-look-at-the-machinations-of-the-eu-neo-fascist-state/)
(http://gatesofvienna.net/wp-content/uploads/2017/11/seneca-pesco10.jpg)
Ironic how thoroughly that applies to you.
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on November 16, 2017, 05:56:28 AM
Ironic how thoroughly that applies to you.
Europe is always killing itself. The amazing times is when it isn't.
Quote from: Cavebear on November 18, 2017, 04:01:50 AM
Europe is always killing itself. The amazing times is when it isn't.
I sometimes get outraged responses when I refer to WWI and WWII as the latest chapters in Europe's eternal civil war.
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on November 18, 2017, 06:23:32 AM
I sometimes get outraged responses when I refer to WWI and WWII as the latest chapters in Europe's eternal civil war.
I agree that Europe always seemed to be in civil war internally or externally in the recent few centuries past. It is probably a result of being the tech giants of the world at the times of their wars. And notably diminished as they are reduced in technology advantage.
Nations tend to fight when they think they have an advantage and advantages are usually tech-driven.
Quote from: Mr.Obvious on November 16, 2017, 02:53:46 AM
Remember, The safe word is 'brexit'.
you know if you say brexit three times in the mirror with the lights off and a candle lite, Margret Thatcher will appear and poll tax you to death.