... Or is this the beginning?
I've been to two Christian forums. Don't ask me why i went there. I got banned from both. They really felt threatened by my presence. My use of common sense and rational thinking was probably too much for them.
They even had a Christian "genius" try to argue with me and I quickly met his challenge with intellectual rebuttals on his own level. He tucked tail and avoided me with silence once he realized that i actually understood everything he was saying and responded accordingly. I guess he didn't expect that. And he claimed to "crucify" new atheists with his attempts to prove his position.
I'm not trying to brag about it though. My point is that once they realized that their best couldn't defeat me, they quickly tried to find reason to ban me. And they couldn't. I gave them nothing. So they made some shit up and succeeded in the ban. I guess I'm not as smart as I thought because I took the bait and now here i am.
I'll discuss my ideas with you guys in hopes of receiving fresh new insight about them. Well it might be old insight but it's new to me. I've been an atheist for less than a year. But I've learned so much since then and i feel that I've truly found freedom in it. I'll explain that later as well.
But for now, I'm glad to be here.
Welcome.
I have little to offer about their "genius" other than not to worry about what intellectuals, true or full of shit, think about you. Anyone who advertises themselves as wise, and think themselves therefor better than you and try to put you down for it, is anything but... regardless of what "side" they are on. Book smarts, or the illusion of having it, is perhaps the most over-rated trait I have encountered in my life.
Quote from: erealmz on October 30, 2017, 11:15:55 PM
... Or is this the beginning?
I've been to two Christian forums. Don't ask me why i went there. I got banned from both. They really felt threatened by my presence. My use of common sense and rational thinking was probably too much for them.
They even had a Christian "genius" try to argue with me and I quickly met his challenge with intellectual rebuttals on his own level. He tucked tail and avoided me with silence once he realized that i actually understood everything he was saying and responded accordingly. I guess he didn't expect that. And he claimed to "crucify" new atheists with his attempts to prove his position.
I'm not trying to brag about it though. My point is that once they realized that their best couldn't defeat me, they quickly tried to find reason to ban me. And they couldn't. I gave them nothing. So they made some shit up and succeeded in the ban. I guess I'm not as smart as I thought because I took the bait and now here i am.
I'll discuss my ideas with you guys in hopes of receiving fresh new insight about them. Well it might be old insight but it's new to me. I've been an atheist for less than a year. But I've learned so much since then and i feel that I've truly found freedom in it. I'll explain that later as well.
But for now, I'm glad to be here.
OK, I'll bite. Why are you an atheist?
Oh thank you. I never saw that one coming. I'll summarize. I've never seen/felt/heard/smelled or otherwise observed any direct evidence for god. I was raised Christian and did the whole shebang. Prayed and never heard any response other than my own thoughts. Never saw any miracle aside from a coincidence or something that could be explained. And I always questioned the whole doctrine because it never made sense to me.
I always hated the concept of hell and thought that God would never send people there. Because if we were supposedly made in his image, and we, as humans, felt that it wasn't fair, then why wouldn't god feel the same way. So I eventually dropped my belief in hell.
Later, i went on a retreat and studied Messianic Judaism for 3 years. I realized that much of what I was taught about Christianity was a lie. Shortly after that, I felt closer to God than I had ever been in my life. I thought i had it all figured out. I thought I know more about it than anyone. I thought I was a chosen one. I felt pure.
When I returned from my 3 year spiritual journey, I saw a fallen world. I saw people pretending to be Christian. I felt the presence of sin all around me. And what got to me the most was that people weren't even trying to live for god. Everyone lived for themselves and went to church on Sunday like it was their ticket to heaven. And it all made me sick. I was so spiritually close to God (a mental state) that I couldn't tolerate this sinful world. So little by little, I gave in. I kept saying "why should I try so hard if no one else is trying at all?". Eventually, my walk faded as I awakened to the reality of the world I lived in.
I started to question God's existence more and more. Until finally, one night on my way to work, I listened to a video on YouTube called "if God existed". And that was the turning point. I agreed with everything in that video. I started watching more and more, so many different videos on the subject. I worked as a truck driver doing the nightshift. So I played those videos while I was driving and simply listened to them. I did this for 6 months straight. There are so many secular videos on YouTube. And I couldn't help but agree with everything they were saying.
And just like that, I realized I no longer believed in any of the doctrines. I had the understanding to know that atheism just made more sense. It answered every single question that I've ever had since I was a kid. That's something that the Bible or Christianity couldn't come close to doing. And from then on, I've taken my stance. I couldn't go back if I wanted to. I can't make myself believe something.
Since then, I've taken responsibility for my own life. I hold myself accountable for my actions and no longer give them to God in return for forgiveness. I take action to make my life better and no longer rely on God to do it for me. Everything I do is of my own decisions, based on my own standards of what I feel is right. And my life has gotten 100 times better because of it. My mind feels free. I know what's right and wrong and it's based on the society that I live in. And I live by those standards. And I'm taking too long here. Wanted to make this short.
So yeah, that's why I'm an atheist. And I will write a book about my experience one day. Because there is so much detail. And I feel that people should know what I've been through and why I am the way I am.
Quote from: erealmz on October 31, 2017, 02:09:04 AM
Oh thank you. I never saw that one coming. I'll summarize. I've never seen/felt/heard/smelled or otherwise observed any direct evidence for god. I was raised Christian and did the whole shebang. Prayed and never heard any response other than my own thoughts. Never saw any miracle aside from a coincidence or something that could be explained. And i always questioned the whole doctrine because it never made sense to me.
I always hated the concept of hell and thought that God would never send people there. Because if we were supposedly made in his image, and we, as humans, felt that it wasn't fair, then why wouldn't god feel the same way. So i eventually dropped my belief in hell.
Later, i went on a retreat and studied Messianic Judaism for 3 years. I realized that much of what I was taught about Christianity was a lie. Shortly after that, I felt closer to God than I had ever been in my life. I thought i had it all figured out. I thought I know more about it than anyone. I thought I was a chosen one. I felt pure.
When I returned from my 3 year spiritual journey, I saw a fallen world. I saw people pretending to be Christian. I felt the presence of sin and around me. And what got to be the most was that people weren't even trying to live for god. Everyone lived for themselves and went to church on Sunday like it was their ticket to heaven. And it all made me sick. I was so spiritually close to God (a mental state) that I couldn't tolerate this sinful world. So little by little, I gave in. I kept saying "why should I try so hard if no one else is trying at all?". Eventually, my walk faded as I awakened to the reality of the world I lived in.
I started to question God's existence more and more. Until finally, one night on my way to work, I listened to a video on YouTube called "if God existed". And that was the turning point. I agreed with everything in that video. I started watching more and more, so many different videos on the subject. I worked as a truck driver doing the nightshift. So I played those videos while i was driving and simply listened to them. I did this for 6 months straight. There are so many secular videos on YouTube. And i couldn't help but agree with everything they were saying.
And just like that, I realized I no longer believed in any of the doctrines. I had the understanding to know that atheism just made more sense. It answered every single question that I've ever had since I was a kid. That's something that the Bible or Christianity couldn't come close to doing. And from then on, I've taken my stance. I couldn't go back if i wanted to. I can't make myself believe something.
Since then, I've taken responsibility for my own life. I hold myself accountable for my actions and no longer give them to God in return for forgiveness. I take action to make my life better and no longer rely on God to do it for me. Everything I do is of my own decisions, based on my own standards of what I feel is right. And my life has gotten 100 times better because of it. My mind feels free. I know what's right and wrong and it's based on the society that i live in. And i live by those standards. And I'm taking too long here. Wanted to make this short.
So yeah, that's why I'm an atheist. And I will write a book about my experience one day. Because there is so much detail. And I feel that people should know what I've been through and why I am the way I am.
Sounds good to me. What do you think happens when you die. Will you know you are dead? Will you see your own ending? Will you see the mourning of those who loved you?
How did the universe begin?
Have you ever approached a traffic light while driving and REALLY hoped it would stay green?
Did you ever see a dying family member and wish that "something" would keep them alive longer?
Would it bother you to be dragged to a pit after death via a tractor naked and just tossed in?
Just asking...
I think when I die, I won't know I'm dead. Nor will i see the ending or people mourning me.
The universe began with a singularity before or behind which we have insufficient data to make a determination. Whether or not it was created or is part of an eternal cycle of initialization events is beyond me.
As for the traffic light, how about this. True story. I don't lie about shit. I was driving a dump truck on 101 heading into San Fransisco. I was extremely tired from working all night. I couldn't stay awake as much as i fought to. So I turned off the next exit to rest for a while. As I drove down the ramp, I totally feel asleep. The exit curved to the left and went under the freeway. But I was headed right for the wall. It was there last thing I remembered. An empty dump truck is a heavy beast. I could have easily killed people for my mistake. Next thing I know, I was waking up and saw a red traffic light in front of me. As I came to, I realized that I was sitting at the light, my foot on the brake, waiting for it to turn green. I will probably never know what happened that day. But I think it had something to do with the subconscious mind. Somehow, I drove that truck while asleep and came to a full stop at the light. But to answer your question, no. I never really hope for a green light any more than I hope for winning lottery numbers. I just go by the probability and try to work with it.
Never wished something would keep a family member alive longer than they could live. They probably wouldn't want that either.
As for your last question. I couldn't give a rats hairy gray tail what happens to my body. If they wanted to preserve it entirely in latex and use it as a gay sex doll, I couldn't care less.
I hate the idea of non-existence. I wish there was an afterlife. The concept is very beautiful. But I just don't believe it anymore. What about you? What's your stance?
Quote from: erealmz on October 31, 2017, 03:20:16 AM
I think when I die, I won't know I'm dead. Nor will i see the ending or people mourning me.
The universe began with a singularity before or behind which we have insufficient data to make a determination. Whether or not it was created or is part of an eternal cycle of initialization events is beyond me.
As for the traffic light, how about this. True story. I don't lie about shit. I was driving a dump truck on 101 heading into San Fransisco. I was extremely tired from working all night. I couldn't stay awake as much as i fought to. So I turned off the next exit to rest for a while. As I drove down the ramp, I totally feel asleep. The exit curved to the left and went under the freeway. But I was headed right for the wall. It was there last thing I remembered. An empty dump truck is a heavy beast. I could have easily killed people for my mistake. Next thing I know, I was waking up and saw a red traffic light in front of me. As I came to, I realized that I was sitting at the light, my foot on the brake, waiting for it to turn green. I will probably never know what happened that day. But I think it had something to do with the subconscious mind. Somehow, I drove that truck while asleep and came to a full stop at the light. But to answer your question, no. I never really hope for a green light any more than I hope for winning lottery numbers. I just go by the probability and try to work with it.
Never wished something would keep a family member alive longer than they could live. They probably wouldn't want that either.
As for your last question. I couldn't give a rats hairy gray tail what happens to my body. If they wanted to preserve it entirely in latex and use it as a gay sex doll, I couldn't care less.
I hate the idea of non-existence. I wish there was an afterlife. The concept is very beautiful. But I just don't believe it anymore. What about you? What's your stance?
Congratulations.
I asked about the traffic light because a religious friend (jewish) was a passenger in my car when I approached a traffic light and spoke out loud "stay green, stay green" and he said (aha) it proved I prayed. I explained that "a hope is not a prayer" and that I was merely desiring that "the random events in the universe operated in my favor at that moment (I was in a hurry)". He remained convinced that I had "prayed". He is no longer a friend.
I think no one knows what happens after they die. Not an afterlife, but that they just can't :know" being dead. I vaguely hope I don't die in the house so that the cats would eat me, but mostly because it would be a bit messy. On the other hand, if it keeps the cats alive until someone figures out I'm dead, that wouldn't be the worst thing.
Welcome. But one point we all must learn ... "It isn't about you". People develop over time. You seem young, but have seen some development. Keep at it, you never know where it leads. Some people here have good arguments regarding atheism over theism. Too many posts, too little time. Enjoy.
Quote from: Baruch on October 31, 2017, 06:38:10 AM
Welcome. But one point we all must learn ... "It isn't about you". People develop over time. You seem young, but have seen some development. Keep at it, you never know where it leads. Some people here have good arguments regarding atheism over theism. Too many posts, too little time. Enjoy.
You know, Baruch, when you eventually become an atheist (and you will - your logic will drive you there), you are gonna be hard REALLY to argue against... Not that *I* would, but newcomers...
Quote from: erealmz on October 30, 2017, 11:15:55 PM
I've been to two Christian forums. Don't ask me why i went there. I got banned from both. They really felt threatened by my presence. My use of common sense and rational thinking was probably too much for them.
Well, duh?! Rational thinking in a Christian form is downright rude. It is a blatant insult to faith. I hope you will use better judgment here.
Welcome to our little band of heathens.
Quote from: SGOS on October 31, 2017, 10:07:31 AM
Well, duh?! Rational thinking in a Christian form is downright rude. It is a blatant insult to faith. I hope you will use better judgment here.
Well, I hope he won't (fail to use rational thinking) here.
Quote from: Cavebear on October 31, 2017, 10:18:42 AM
Well, I hope he won't (fail to use rational thinking) here.
We'll see. Apparently, my sarcasm often fails.
Quote from: SGOS on October 31, 2017, 10:25:44 AM
We'll see. Apparently, my sarcasm often fails.
You can generally tell sarc face to face. In words, it comes across literally. That is probably why there are ; and emojis.
Welcome, erealmz. You're story is very similar to mine. We both dove head first into spirituality, and then we realized there was nothing of substance there. If you haven't discovered this yet, you'll see it soon. People like us are terrifying to devout Christians. They will try hard to claim that we were not real Christians so they can dismiss our experiences, because to admit that our faith was genuine and that we still lost it is a scary concept for them. It means that the same can happen to them.
Hi & welcome.
Hey, glad you could make the scene!
Getting kicked out of Christian forums is de rigueur for this place - I think you'll fit right in! Many of us here were former Christians (or other theistic types), but we were lucky, or something, and found our way out of the God-maze.
Condiment Christ:
(https://i.pinimg.com/736x/62/ed/c3/62edc31c323a35e0c54558cfb67ffb63--church-bulletin-boards-religious-bulletin-boards.jpg)
Unbeliever - Hey, I got kicked out of a PC religious tolerance forum on Facebook, for saying bad things about Catholics and WW II ... does that count?
Greetings. I hope you hand around and share your insights.
Quote from: Baruch on October 31, 2017, 06:45:22 PM
Unbeliever - Hey, I got kicked out of a PC religious tolerance forum on Facebook, for saying bad things about Catholics and WW II ... does that count?
Hey, if it floats your boat, it counts.
Quote from: Unbeliever on October 31, 2017, 07:00:01 PM
Hey, if it floats your boat, it counts.
Tolerance is self contradictory if based on dishonesty.
Quote from: erealmz on October 31, 2017, 03:20:16 AM
I hate the idea of non-existence. I wish there was an afterlife. The concept is very beautiful. But I just don't believe it anymore. What about you? What's your stance?
My idea of the perfect afterlife is cruising around the universe unfettered by the laws of physics just observing and learning. Seeing what's out there that I couldn't imagine no matter how hard I tried. That's the only afterlife I have any interest in. The whole robes and halos and eternally singing praises? Eurgh. Show me the way to the 'down' elevator.
Wings would be way cool, though -- but not if I was invisible and couldn't show them off. :D
"I hate the idea of non-existence. I wish there was an afterlife. The concept is very beautiful. But I just don't believe it anymore. What about you? What's your stance?"
What is time, what is past, present and future? What is life? Without answers to that ... "afterlife" is meaningless.
For me we are wrong about everything. Most people think we are alive now ... I disagree rhetorically ... we are dead now. Therefore, such as it is, this is the afterlife. Thus for me, it isn't a belief thing, it is a reality after one defines ones terms reasonably. On there other hand, non-existence is impossible. I think you must mean ... perpetual deep unconsciousness. That would be very boring, but you wouldn't be aware of it. Are you aware of your deep sleep now? For most people "afterlife" is a projection from day dreams and night dreams. I find dreams to be pretty weird at worst, and wishful thinking at best.
Quote from: Unbeliever on October 31, 2017, 04:38:41 PM
Hey, glad you could make the scene!
Getting kicked out of Christian forums is de rigueur for this place - I think you'll fit right in! Many of us here were former Christians (or other theistic types), but we were lucky, or something, and found our way out of the God-maze.
I got kicked out of a 'Clan Of The Cave Bear' site eventually because they all believed in "The Mother Earth Goddess" and I objected one too many times.
As an atheist, I don't believe in any deities; modern, ancient or pre-historic. But disbelieving in just one circles the tribes against you. LOL!
Condiment Christ:
(https://i.pinimg.com/736x/62/ed/c3/62edc31c323a35e0c54558cfb67ffb63--church-bulletin-boards-religious-bulletin-boards.jpg)
That is why Cavebear posts here ... the Cro-Magnons don't believe in him anymore ;-)
Fortunately there are still plenty of Neanderthals, here ... that do ;-))
Quote from: Baruch on November 04, 2017, 09:49:45 AM
That is why Cavebear posts here ... the Cro-Magnons don't believe in him anymore ;-)
Fortunately there are still plenty of Neanderthals, here ... that do ;-))
I KNEW there was a thread where I accidentally hit "send" before adding content! I'm glad to have found it.
Hey, if a Cro-Magnon had been raised from birth among us here, you probably couldn't tell thye difference. And it is starting to seem the same about Neanderthals. They weren't stupider, just outnumbered. Latest info suggests there were just more Homo Sapiens entering Europe than Neanderthals there.