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News & General Discussion => News Stories and Current Events => Topic started by: Hydra009 on January 25, 2017, 09:55:22 PM

Title: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Hydra009 on January 25, 2017, 09:55:22 PM
QuotePresident Trump took to Twitter on Tuesday night to re-up the idea of sending federal law enforcement to Chicago if the city’s homicide rate doesn’t come down.

“If Chicago doesn't fix the horrible ‘carnage’ going on,” Trump wrote, “I will send in the Feds!”

He said in his tweet that 228 shootings and 42 homicides have been recorded in Chicago since the start of the year â€" figures higher than the comparable period during 2016, which was a particularly bloody year for the city.
QuoteTrump has raised the prospect of Washington intervention in Chicago before. His latest musings on the subject came just a day after Chicago Mayor Rahm Emanuel (D) criticized the Republican president for focusing so much on the size of the crowd at his inaugural ceremony and failing in his speech to appeal to “our better angels as a country.”
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2017/01/24/trump-threatens-to-send-in-the-feds-to-address-chicago-carnage/ (https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2017/01/24/trump-threatens-to-send-in-the-feds-to-address-chicago-carnage/)

Just a day after getting criticized by Chicago's mayor, Trump casts aspersions on Chicago, indirectly criticizing Chicago's mayor and shifting attention away from his own failings.  What a strange coincidence.

Apparently, the tweet coincided with a Fox News segment on Chicago (http://www.salon.com/2017/01/25/donald-trump-threatens-to-impose-martial-law-in-chicago-and-it-may-be-over-a-feud-with-rahm-emanuel/) with Trump using identical language as one of their hosts (which explains the scarequotes around "carnage").  Another odd coincidence that actually explains a lot about Trump.

To be fair, there is a big problem here - Chicago does have a high homicide rate (http://www.cnn.com/2016/09/06/us/chicago-homicides-visual-guide/) even though the per capita homicide rate is less than some other cities.

And of course, the problem has a lot to do with guns, and we all know Trump has no real interest in tackling that problem, so color me skeptical about his intentions on solving this problem.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on January 26, 2017, 06:49:58 AM
Directed against Obama associate, Rahm ... and maybe his kooky Dr brother.  Also against the Mossad infiltration of America.  If this does happen, it is no different than Jack Kennedy sending in the Feds to the South when things got out of hand with local officials down there.  I would do this with the sanctuary cities, and make California admit to bankruptcy ... put it under US Treasury Dept receivership.  This should have happened in Detroit, decades before it finally did.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: PopeyesPappy on January 26, 2017, 07:30:44 AM
Trump wants Chicago to institute a policy of stop and frisk by the police similar to the one used in New York. The one that was ruled unconstitutional 3 or 4 years ago. While the effectiveness of such a policy at reducing violent crime can be argued, the legality of targeting racial minority men almost exclusively is indefensible in light of the 4th and 14th amendments. 
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Atheon on January 26, 2017, 07:38:41 AM
Whether this is motivated by racism (it was, after all, inspired by a report by Bill O'Reilly), or genuine concern about gang violence, this is going to be perceived as an attack on the black community. Either way, nothing good is gong to come out of this, except perhaps growing opposition to Trump.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: SGOS on January 26, 2017, 08:44:26 AM
Chicago has a lot of murder and crime in general.  It would be nice to clean that up, but I'm not sure if the Feds can do it better than the police.  I went to high school in the suburb of Cicero, home to Al Capone.  I never felt really safe there, although I survived.  I was mugged once and another time took a beating from a gang that would cruise around and randomly beat up people as part of their Friday night recreation. I feel safer in the woods a half mile from my nearest neighbors, not to say some asshole could never bother me here, but I don't feel I need to worry about it.  I actually feel like we don't even need any police where I live.  In Chicago, I'd want a cop within shouting distance all the time.  Last time I rode the subway, there were signs in the cars that read, "If you feel like you are in danger, move to another car."  At one stop, a cop got on with a muzzled attack dog, rode the subway for two stops and got off.  I suppose it was a trouble spot.  I saw a woman have her purse snatched on the subway one time.

There is a lot of culture in Chicago, with great museums of science, natural history, art, and interesting cultural events that reside in the midst  of assault and crime.  But then I lived in San Pedro, California for 6 months, and that seemed even less safe.  You had all of Chicago's crime, without the culture.

But I have no idea how you clean those places up.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: PopeyesPappy on January 26, 2017, 09:27:56 AM
Quote from: SGOS on January 26, 2017, 08:44:26 AM
But I have no idea how you clean those places up.

Long term you provide education and good jobs in areas like Fuller, Washington and Garfield Park, Englewood and Grand Crossing. Or you could drop a few small nukes, cover what’s left with concrete, and start all over again. My guess is the later would be the preferred solution for the current regime.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: AllPurposeAtheist on January 26, 2017, 09:48:43 AM
Trump's solution will be bigly stupendously YUGE! Just randomly grab people off the streets and torture them till they tell us who's behind all of it. Torture enoughly people and someone will spill the beans.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: AllPurposeAtheist on January 26, 2017, 09:52:04 AM
Quote from: PopeyesPappy on January 26, 2017, 09:27:56 AM
Long term you provide education and good jobs in areas like Fuller, Washington and Garfield Park, Englewood and Grand Crossing. Or you could drop a few small nukes, cover what’s left with concrete, and start all over again. My guess is the later would be the preferred solution for the current regime.
Oh c'mon Pappy, you know that education and jobs are a hoax to make people think that they are smart and can pay the bills. The Donald tells us so and everyone knows he's never been known to be wrong about anything.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on January 26, 2017, 09:53:26 AM
At least he's not interfering with the States' affairs. Damn Big Government needs to have its swamp drained.

(http://rationalia.com/forum/images/smilies/sarcasm.gif)
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: AllPurposeAtheist on January 26, 2017, 10:01:44 AM
Yup, bring in the feds to kill anyone who even looks like they might have the ability to murder someone especially kids..Everyone knows kids all grow up to become murderers and we know this because they all grow up to eventually die anyway.. or something like that..
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Hydra009 on January 26, 2017, 11:22:44 AM
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on January 26, 2017, 09:53:26 AM
At least he's not interfering with the States' affairs. Damn Big Government needs to have its swamp drained.

(http://rationalia.com/forum/images/smilies/sarcasm.gif)
Yeah, Republicans seem to have no problem with federal power when they're the ones exercising it (and more often than not, wielding it like a cudgel)
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on January 26, 2017, 12:05:51 PM
Look out Chi-town, T.rump's coming for your guns!
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on January 26, 2017, 12:54:45 PM
Quote from: Atheon on January 26, 2017, 07:38:41 AM
Whether this is motivated by racism (it was, after all, inspired by a report by Bill O'Reilly), or genuine concern about gang violence, this is going to be perceived as an attack on the black community. Either way, nothing good is gong to come out of this, except perhaps growing opposition to Trump.

Young women take their freedom for granted.  African-Americans who are middle class take their freedom for granted.  Both groups are losing, because you have to defend, every single day.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on January 26, 2017, 12:55:55 PM
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on January 26, 2017, 09:53:26 AM
At least he's not interfering with the States' affairs. Damn Big Government needs to have its swamp drained.

(http://rationalia.com/forum/images/smilies/sarcasm.gif)

Yes, break up California .. into one city state per county.  Divide and conquer.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on January 26, 2017, 01:27:12 PM
Quote from: Baruch on January 26, 2017, 12:55:55 PM
Yes, break up California .. into one city state per county.  Divide and conquer.
I'm all for the twelve mile limit.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: SGOS on January 26, 2017, 03:09:54 PM
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on January 26, 2017, 01:27:12 PM
I'm all for the twelve mile limit. 

Then Los Angeles will be the world's 7th largest economy.  Well, Orange County, anyway.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Unbeliever on January 26, 2017, 03:22:30 PM
Quote from: AllPurposeAtheist on January 26, 2017, 09:48:43 AM
Trump's solution will be bigly stupendously YUGE! Just randomly grab people off the streets and torture them till they tell us who's behind all of it. Torture enoughly people and someone will spill the beans.
Yeah, and he can torture and kill their families too! That'll learn the fuckers!
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on January 26, 2017, 06:20:27 PM
Quote from: Unbeliever on January 26, 2017, 03:22:30 PM
Yeah, and he can torture and kill their families too! That'll learn the fuckers!

All part of the "start a race war" narrative of the Southern Republicans (whose daddy was a Southern Democrat).
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on January 26, 2017, 06:21:31 PM
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on January 26, 2017, 01:27:12 PM
I'm all for the twelve mile limit.

But do we have to speak Greek, and divide into pro-Sparta vs pro-Athens?
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on January 27, 2017, 06:57:21 AM
The twelve-mile limit was the (then) range of coastal artillery, and hence the effective range of control of the sea by a nation.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on January 27, 2017, 07:33:10 AM
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on January 27, 2017, 06:57:21 AM
The twelve-mile limit was the (then) range of coastal artillery, and hence the effective range of control of the sea by a nation.

Oh, I didn't think you were just talking about coastal stuff, what about Fly Over Country?  I thought you were talking about how far it is convenient for a girly Athenian warrior to march in one day ;-)  This is Sparta!
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on January 27, 2017, 11:44:45 AM
Quote from: Baruch on January 27, 2017, 07:33:10 AM
Oh, I didn't think you were just talking about coastal stuff, what about Fly Over Country?  I thought you were talking about how far it is convenient for a girly Athenian warrior to march in one day ;-)  This is Sparta!
My point is that this was a far as "national" sovereignty extended. So why not extend that down to the local level? "States' Rights!" people want states to have all the power, what about counties? Or townships? How about making each city block an independent nation?
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Hydra009 on January 27, 2017, 12:22:13 PM
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on January 27, 2017, 11:44:45 AM
My point is that this was a far as "national" sovereignty extended. So why not extend that down to the local level? "States' Rights!" people want states to have all the power, what about counties? Or townships? How about making each city block an independent nation?
You're thinking about that far too logically.  What they're really talking about is for state policy to override federal policy when the state policy is more conservative position than the federal policy.  It's not about states rights or limiting federal power, it's about enacting conservative policies by any means.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on January 27, 2017, 01:04:18 PM
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on January 27, 2017, 11:44:45 AM
My point is that this was a far as "national" sovereignty extended. So why not extend that down to the local level? "States' Rights!" people want states to have all the power, what about counties? Or townships? How about making each city block an independent nation?

We have a Federal system.  We aren't supposed to have tyranny at any level, dialectic and negotiation.  Or are you saying we need an Emperor (like Japan), who appoints local representatives from the royal court to take care of Emperor business at the local level?

Yes, some people would like anarchism .. and the individual level though, not at the city state level.  The Spartans are dead ;-(
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on January 27, 2017, 03:02:47 PM
Quote from: Hydra009 on January 27, 2017, 12:22:13 PM
You're thinking about that far too logically.  What they're really talking about is for state policy to override federal policy when the state policy is more conservative position than the federal policy.  It's not about states rights or limiting federal power, it's about enacting conservative policies by any means.
Yeah, I am a historian.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on January 27, 2017, 03:03:19 PM
Quote from: Baruch on January 27, 2017, 01:04:18 PM
We have a Federal system.  We aren't supposed to have tyranny at any level, dialectic and negotiation.  Or are you saying we need an Emperor (like Japan), who appoints local representatives from the royal court to take care of Emperor business at the local level?

Yes, some people would like anarchism .. and the individual level though, not at the city state level.  The Spartans are dead ;-(
The Greeks had city states. The Hard Right wants shitty states.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Unbeliever on January 27, 2017, 05:22:52 PM
What's the current status of posse comitatus and habeus corpus? I hope Chump isn't maniac enough to use the American military in Chicago, against American citizens!

But then, I'm a cynical pessimist, so I expect the worst...
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on January 27, 2017, 07:52:57 PM
Quote from: Unbeliever on January 27, 2017, 05:22:52 PM
What's the current status of posse comitatus and habeus corpus? I hope Chump isn't maniac enough to use the American military in Chicago, against American citizens!

But then, I'm a cynical pessimist, so I expect the worst...

Both were killed first by Bill Clinton, then by George W.  Barak has simply followed through to the logical conclusion ... the President is G-d.  Even more than Nixon claimed.  We used the National Guard in Watts, in 1965.  Not saying we will see that again (last time was in 1992 again in LA).  Are you offended?  And yes, under local military law, you have no snowflake rights.  You observe curfew and avoid crowds.  If you loot, you might get shot.  The reaction to the Baltimore riot last year was mild by the authorities.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P43WZd611WA
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Poison Tree on January 28, 2017, 01:38:59 AM
Quote from: AllPurposeAtheist on January 26, 2017, 09:48:43 AM
Trump's solution will be bigly stupendously YUGE! Just randomly grab people off the streets and torture them till they tell us who's behind all of it. Torture enoughly people and someone will spill the beans.
wouldn't be the first time (https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/10/10000-files-on-chicago-police-torture-decades-now-online/504233/)
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on January 28, 2017, 04:22:56 AM
Yes, in-terror-gation is a bitch.  We used to toss VietCong out the hatch of our helicopters, to convince them to talk to us.  America doesn't play nice.  Best not to fall into the hands of the Fuzz.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on January 28, 2017, 03:27:42 PM
Quote from: Unbeliever on January 27, 2017, 05:22:52 PM
What's the current status of posse comitatus and habeus corpus? I hope Chump isn't maniac enough to use the American military in Chicago, against American citizens!

But then, I'm a cynical pessimist, so I expect the worst...
Posse Comitatus applies to the use of the military to enforce laws within the boundaries of the states. "The feds" isn't a turn used on military very often, if at all.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Unbeliever on January 28, 2017, 04:08:17 PM
Quote from: Baruch on January 27, 2017, 07:52:57 PM
Both were killed first by Bill Clinton, then by George W.  Barak has simply followed through to the logical conclusion ... the President is G-d.  Even more than Nixon claimed.  We used the National Guard in Watts, in 1965.  Not saying we will see that again (last time was in 1992 again in LA).  Are you offended?  And yes, under local military law, you have no snowflake rights.  You observe curfew and avoid crowds.  If you loot, you might get shot.  The reaction to the Baltimore riot last year was mild by the authorities.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P43WZd611WA
Does the national guard come under the purview of posse comitatus?
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on January 28, 2017, 08:54:46 PM
Posse committals and habeus corpus is dead (irony).  The Feds can be used anywhere in the US (and even the Federal Reserve has their own storm troopers) to enforce Federal law, that is what Lincoln was doing at Ft Sumpter.  Also all the folks who used to star with Mat Dillon on Gunsmoke, they are all dead now.

The crucial difference, is that starting with George W ... the National Guard was federalized, and kept that way.  Most people who serve over-seas are National Guard and Reservists, not Regulars.  This way, none of the Governors have any practical authority over them.  Any troops with regional sympathies are out of the way.

Anyone remember Jade Helm exercise just 18 months ago?
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on January 28, 2017, 08:56:03 PM
Quote from: PopeyesPappy on January 26, 2017, 07:30:44 AM
Trump wants Chicago to institute a policy of stop and frisk by the police similar to the one used in New York. The one that was ruled unconstitutional 3 or 4 years ago. While the effectiveness of such a policy at reducing violent crime can be argued, the legality of targeting racial minority men almost exclusively is indefensible in light of the 4th and 14th amendments.

Declare everyone a racial minority, and the issue becomes moot.  That is the whole point of modern White specialness.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on January 29, 2017, 08:50:52 AM
Quote from: Unbeliever on January 28, 2017, 04:08:17 PM
Does the national guard come under the purview of posse comitatus?
Officially, the US Army is the only branch covered under posse comitatus. I operated under it by orders of the Secretary of the Navy (given to the Deserter Apprehension Program explicitly when it was formed.)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on January 29, 2017, 03:39:51 PM
From Wiki ... yes/no ...
"Federal military personnel have a long history of domestic roles, including the occupation of secessionist Southern states during Reconstruction. The Posse Comitatus Act prohibits the use of federal military personnel to "execute the laws"; however, there is disagreement over whether this language may apply to troops used in an advisory, support, disaster response, or other homeland defense role, as opposed to domestic law enforcement.[1]

On March 10, 2009, members of the U.S. Army Military Police Corps from Fort Rucker were deployed to Samson, Alabama, in response to a murder spree. Samson officials confirmed that the soldiers assisted in traffic control and securing the crime scene. The governor of Alabama did not request military assistance nor did President Obama authorize their deployment. Subsequent investigation found that the Posse Comitatus Act was violated and several military members received "administrative actions".[13][14]"

So it depends in which capacity they are used, and depending on what a judge thinks.  The last example is clear, because while the governor didn't authorize it, neither did the President.  But if a governor didn't authorize it, but a President did ... I see no problem.  That may happen in California shortly.  My original point being ... this was originally envisaged as part of States Rights, and governors as mini-CnC ... which is where the call-up of Confederate troops came from.  That will not be allowed to happen again.  De facto, the National Guard is federalized, otherwise the Civil Rights enforcements of the 1960s couldn't have happened, since no Southern governor would have authorized it.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Jason Harvestdancer on February 04, 2017, 12:01:28 PM
There are ways this won't work, and ways this might work.  Have the federal government take over administration of Chicago, suspend the gun laws, give a 9mm semi-automatic hand gun to every adult who doesn't have a criminal record, and wait.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on February 04, 2017, 01:19:59 PM
Quote from: Jason Harvestdancer on February 04, 2017, 12:01:28 PM
There are ways this won't work, and ways this might work.  Have the federal government take over administration of Chicago, suspend the gun laws, give a 9mm semi-automatic hand gun to every adult who doesn't have a criminal record, and wait.
..who doesn't have a criminal record YET...
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on February 04, 2017, 01:39:34 PM
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on February 04, 2017, 01:19:59 PM
..who doesn't have a criminal record YET...

Chicago .. Chicago .... my kind of town, my kind of town ...
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Hydra009 on February 04, 2017, 02:42:21 PM
Quote from: Jason Harvestdancer on February 04, 2017, 12:01:28 PM
There are ways this won't work, and ways this might work.  Have the federal government take over administration of Chicago, suspend the gun laws, give a 9mm semi-automatic hand gun to every adult who doesn't have a criminal record, and wait.
Okay, so we have a good example of the won't work category.  What about the might work category?
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Jason Harvestdancer on February 04, 2017, 03:36:05 PM
Quote from: Hydra009 on February 04, 2017, 02:42:21 PM
Okay, so we have a good example of the won't work category.  What about the might work category?

Looking for a will work?  Make gun ownership mandatory for all non-criminals instead of merely optional.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Hydra009 on February 04, 2017, 03:52:30 PM
Quote from: Jason Harvestdancer on February 04, 2017, 03:36:05 PMMake gun ownership mandatory for all non-criminals instead of merely optional.
That's got to be the dumbest thing I've ever read on this site, and we get creationists and flat earthers on occasion.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Jason Harvestdancer on February 04, 2017, 04:25:52 PM
Hm yes, because there is no statistical correlation between how hard it is to acquire a firearm and the high crime rates of various US citizens.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Cavebear on February 05, 2017, 06:11:13 AM
Quote from: Baruch on January 26, 2017, 12:55:55 PM
Yes, break up California .. into one city state per county.  Divide and conquer.

Oh please let us do that.  Make California 5 States.  That will mean 8 more Democratic Senators!  In return, lets remand the District of Columbia to Maryland and solve THAT annoying electoral issue. 
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on February 05, 2017, 07:27:34 AM
Quote from: Jason Harvestdancer on February 04, 2017, 03:36:05 PM
Looking for a will work?  Make gun ownership mandatory for all non-criminals instead of merely optional.
Yeah, more guns always make things better.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on February 05, 2017, 09:38:02 AM
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on February 05, 2017, 07:27:34 AM
Yeah, more guns always make things better.

More voters don't make things better ;-)  And I swear, some vote loaded ;-))
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Cavebear on February 15, 2017, 03:23:58 AM
Lets send EVERYONE in Detroit guns and let them fight it out.  When the population gets down to about zero, the housing market will be WIDE open for Trumpian-style profit!!!
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Jason78 on February 15, 2017, 04:17:59 AM
Nuke the city from orbit.   It's the only way to be sure.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Cavebear on February 17, 2017, 01:53:40 AM
Yeah, only way to be sure...
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Unbeliever on February 17, 2017, 05:39:26 PM
Quote from: Jason Harvestdancer on February 04, 2017, 12:01:28 PM
There are ways this won't work, and ways this might work.  Have the federal government take over administration of Chicago, suspend the gun laws, give a 9mm semi-automatic hand gun to every adult who doesn't have a criminal record, and wait.
That sounds like Archie Bunker's idea that to stop hijackings they should issue every passenger a "rod."


(http://playstationna.i.lithium.com/t5/image/serverpage/image-id/431326iD647EBF29D898FC2?v=1.0)




Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on February 17, 2017, 06:50:47 PM
Quote from: Unbeliever on February 17, 2017, 05:39:26 PM
That sounds like Archie Bunker's idea that to stop hijackings they should issue every passenger a "rod."


(http://playstationna.i.lithium.com/t5/image/serverpage/image-id/431326iD647EBF29D898FC2?v=1.0)

TSA was an even worse solution ;-(
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Sorginak on February 17, 2017, 08:43:09 PM
Trump is an idiot who has seen too many cop shows. 
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on February 18, 2017, 06:01:08 AM
I love his habit of saying things like "Send in the feds", because he has no idea who would be sent or what theytw ould do, or how it would be accomplished. T.rump knows nothing about the realities of government.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on February 18, 2017, 06:31:53 AM
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on February 18, 2017, 06:01:08 AM
I love his habit of saying things like "Send in the feds", because he has no idea who would be sent or what theytw ould do, or how it would be accomplished. T.rump knows nothing about the realities of government.

Obama was an expert?  Only at posturing.  A real President would realize you can't push a rope, or a Congress controlled by an opposition party.  And when Congress was controlled by his party, we got ACA, which is in meltdown.  But then Biden was the real President, as was Cheney in the prior administration.  Why impeach Trump, when Pence is probably the real President from the get-go?  You Americans, so easily fooled.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on February 18, 2017, 05:56:06 PM
Quote from: Baruch on February 18, 2017, 06:31:53 AM
Obama was an expert?  Only at posturing.
You're consistent with the bullshit, I'll give you that much. Do you have any filters at all?
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on February 18, 2017, 09:08:25 PM
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on February 18, 2017, 05:56:06 PM
You're consistent with the bullshit, I'll give you that much. Do you have any filters at all?

I voted for Obama twice, because of the Republican alternative ... the first time on hope and change ... but we didn't get any from the "fake-in-chief".  It is like the Bush Sr's Potatoe Head VP is channeling his thoughts into the last 4 Presidents (including Trump).
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on February 18, 2017, 09:47:50 PM
Quote from: Baruch on February 18, 2017, 09:08:25 PM
I voted for Obama twice, because of the Republican alternative ... the first time on hope and change ... but we didn't get any from the "fake-in-chief".  It is like the Bush Sr's Potatoe Head VP is channeling his thoughts into the last 4 Presidents (including Trump).
Non sequiturs as usual.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Cavebear on February 19, 2017, 02:02:31 AM
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on February 18, 2017, 09:47:50 PM
Non sequiturs as usual.

Agree... 
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on February 19, 2017, 06:56:15 AM
Quote from: Cavebear on February 19, 2017, 02:02:31 AM
Agree...

I tell the truth, you agree to pig latin ... oink.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Cavebear on February 19, 2017, 11:51:42 PM
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on February 18, 2017, 09:47:50 PM
Non sequiturs as usual.

"Fake-in-chief" is good...
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on February 20, 2017, 07:28:23 AM
Quote from: Cavebear on February 19, 2017, 11:51:42 PM
"Fake-in-chief" is good...

What is the sound of millions of D people crying?
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on February 20, 2017, 03:30:59 PM
Quote from: Cavebear on February 19, 2017, 11:51:42 PM
"Fake-in-chief" is good...
Some farts sound down right musical, yes.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Unbeliever on February 21, 2017, 04:41:42 PM
Quote from: Sorginak on February 17, 2017, 08:43:09 PM
Trump is an idiot who has seen too many cop shows. 
And apparently gets his information (I can't use the word "intelligence" in reference to him...) from (Faux [News?]).
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Unbeliever on February 21, 2017, 07:16:17 PM
Just think, we could've had Ben Carson for president!


(http://i1.wp.com/www.ifyouonlynews.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Capture36.jpg)



(https://sepaman.files.wordpress.com/2013/09/double-aught.jpg)
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on February 21, 2017, 07:23:46 PM
Unfortunately, the Titanic wasn't a good comparison for anyone.  It had numerous design flaws, and the captain failed in his duty as well.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on February 21, 2017, 09:29:49 PM
Quote from: Unbeliever on February 21, 2017, 07:16:17 PM
Just think, we could've had Ben Carson for president!


(http://i1.wp.com/www.ifyouonlynews.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Capture36.jpg)
Nobody built the Ark.


(https://sepaman.files.wordpress.com/2013/09/double-aught.jpg)
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Unbeliever on February 22, 2017, 05:51:53 PM
Quote from: Baruch on February 21, 2017, 07:23:46 PM
Unfortunately, the Titanic wasn't a good comparison for anyone.  It had numerous design flaws, and the captain failed in his duty as well.
Yeah, only the iceberg was competent enough to do its job right that fateful night...
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Cavebear on February 23, 2017, 08:32:41 AM
Quote from: Unbeliever on February 22, 2017, 05:51:53 PM
Yeah, only the iceberg was competent enough to do its job right that fateful night...

One might question the idea that the iceberg "had a job to do".
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on February 23, 2017, 12:35:01 PM
Quote from: Cavebear on February 23, 2017, 08:32:41 AM
One might question the idea that the iceberg "had a job to do".

Its job was to melt ... and eventually it did that, after it got the big ship out of its eye ;-)
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on February 23, 2017, 01:16:36 PM
The usual ship from Baruch.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on February 23, 2017, 02:03:55 PM
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on February 23, 2017, 01:16:36 PM
The usual ship from Baruch.

Yes, my whit is Titanic ... thanks!
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Unbeliever on February 23, 2017, 06:00:17 PM
Quote from: Cavebear on February 23, 2017, 08:32:41 AM
One might question the idea that the iceberg "had a job to do".
Just a figure of speech, not meant to be taken literally.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on February 23, 2017, 06:25:05 PM
Quote from: Baruch on February 23, 2017, 02:03:55 PM
Yes, my whit is Titanic ... thanks!
Positively benthic.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on February 23, 2017, 06:25:51 PM
Quote from: Unbeliever on February 23, 2017, 06:00:17 PM
Just a figure of speech, not meant to be taken literally.
Relax. Some people get the wit, others only get half of it.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Unbeliever on February 23, 2017, 06:37:38 PM
OK, I'll try hard to relax...
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on February 23, 2017, 07:43:41 PM
Quote from: Unbeliever on February 23, 2017, 06:00:17 PM
Just a figure of speech, not meant to be taken literally.

Allegorically?  What are you, religious? ;-)
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Unbeliever on February 23, 2017, 07:47:01 PM
Yeah, I'm religiously non-religious...
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on February 23, 2017, 07:53:33 PM
Quote from: Unbeliever on February 23, 2017, 07:47:01 PM
Yeah, I'm religiously non-religious...

Well, don't self annihilate ... the IRS will do it for you ;-(
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: fencerider on February 26, 2017, 04:32:31 AM
back to the OP... what can Trump legally do in Chicago? If I was pres, I would like to have the power to fire out of control cops. Of course when little boy is pres and his biggest reason to go after Chicago is because Obama is from there, I dont know if its such a good idea for the pres to have any power.

Somebody has to know what he can legally do. I know there isn't any authority in the Constitution, but I never tried reading USC
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Cavebear on February 26, 2017, 04:36:10 AM
So the iceberg had a purpose and the Titanic was there to be employed for that purpose...

Screaming illogic...
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on February 26, 2017, 09:03:09 AM
Quote from: Cavebear on February 26, 2017, 04:36:10 AM
So the iceberg had a purpose and the Titanic was there to be employed for that purpose...

Screaming illogic...

Are you enjoying your Mai Tai with the little umbrella, on the Promenade Deck, Mr Bear?  The USS America is going down.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Cavebear on February 26, 2017, 10:48:31 AM
Quote from: Baruch on February 26, 2017, 09:03:09 AM
Are you enjoying your Mai Tai with the little umbrella, on the Promenade Deck, Mr Bear?  The USS America is going down.

I didn't mention the iceberg originally, so I guess you are making a joke at yourself.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on February 26, 2017, 08:18:55 PM
Quote from: Cavebear on February 26, 2017, 10:48:31 AM
I didn't mention the iceberg originally, so I guess you are making a joke at yourself.

And when you were a kid ... you were Ursus Minor.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Cavebear on March 02, 2017, 05:50:38 AM
Quote from: Baruch on February 26, 2017, 08:18:55 PM
And when you were a kid ... you were Ursus Minor.

Ursus spelaeus.  Jeez where is your mind at?
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on March 02, 2017, 07:15:52 AM
Quote from: Cavebear on March 02, 2017, 05:50:38 AM
Ursus spelaeus.  Jeez where is your mind at?

In the stars, apparently.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Cavebear on March 02, 2017, 09:01:20 AM
Quote from: Baruch on March 02, 2017, 07:15:52 AM
In the stars, apparently.

The difference between the stars and fog is slight.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Unbeliever on March 02, 2017, 05:06:21 PM
Quote from: Baruch on February 23, 2017, 07:53:33 PM
Well, don't self annihilate ... the IRS will do it for you ;-(
Not me, I haven't paid taxes in decades, and won't, ever again.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Unbeliever on March 02, 2017, 05:09:54 PM
As the commander-in-Chief, is Chump subject to the UCMJ (http://www.au.af.mil/au/awc/awcgate/ucmj.htm)?
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on March 02, 2017, 06:16:19 PM
Quote from: Unbeliever on March 02, 2017, 05:09:54 PM
As the commander-in-Chief, is Chump subject to the UCMJ (http://www.au.af.mil/au/awc/awcgate/ucmj.htm)?
No, he's not in the military. No contract signed.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on March 02, 2017, 06:55:00 PM
Quote from: Unbeliever on March 02, 2017, 05:09:54 PM
As the commander-in-Chief, is Chump subject to the UCMJ (http://www.au.af.mil/au/awc/awcgate/ucmj.htm)?

Not according to Nixon ;-)
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on March 02, 2017, 07:21:41 PM
Chapter 47), is the foundation of military law in the United States. The UCMJ applies to all members of the Uniformed services of the United States: the Air Force, Army, Coast Guard, Marine Corps, Navy, National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration Commissioned Corps, and Public Health Service Commissioned Corps.
About « UCMJ â€" United States Code of Military Justice
www.ucmj.us/about-the-ucmj
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Cavebear on March 05, 2017, 05:06:14 AM
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on March 02, 2017, 06:16:19 PM
No, he's not in the military. No contract signed.

As best I can tell, he is not.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on March 05, 2017, 07:54:04 AM
Nor is the SecDef or other civilian leadership of the DoD ... and the President heads up that civilian hierarchy.  But maybe we need to change that, end civilian leadership of the US, in favor of uniformed leadership?
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Cavebear on March 05, 2017, 07:59:22 AM
Quote from: Baruch on March 05, 2017, 07:54:04 AM
Nor is the SecDef or other civilian leadership of the DoD ... and the President heads up that civilian hierarchy.  But maybe we need to change that, end civilian leadership of the US, in favor of uniformed leadership?

Sadly, another of your unserious arguments.  If you want to suggest the US should become a military dictatorship, go ahead and argue for it straightforwardly.  Don't make snarky suggestions you cannot support.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on March 05, 2017, 08:29:36 AM
Quote from: Cavebear on March 05, 2017, 07:59:22 AM
Sadly, another of your unserious arguments.  If you want to suggest the US should become a military dictatorship, go ahead and argue for it straightforwardly.  Don't make snarky suggestions you cannot support.

I made a question, not a statement, not an innuendo.  Is the SecDef civilian or not?  Is the Potus the boss of the SecDef, yes or no.  I am agreeing with you, you big pile of fur ;-)

On that topic ... military dictatorship ... no, I don't advocate for that.  I work for the military, half of my life so far.  I know them.  They have some advantages over civilians (in the US at least).  As far as the chaos on the civilian side of US political leadership goes ... it is a mess.  The American people as a whole could change that, I as an individual cannot (I am no egomaniac like Edward Snowden).
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Gawdzilla Sama on March 05, 2017, 09:19:31 AM
Quote from: Baruch on March 05, 2017, 07:54:04 AM
Nor is the SecDef or other civilian leadership of the DoD ... and the President heads up that civilian hierarchy.  But maybe we need to change that, end civilian leadership of the US, in favor of uniformed leadership?
Newburgh taught us that's not a good idea.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on March 05, 2017, 10:47:07 AM
Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on March 05, 2017, 09:19:31 AM
Newburgh taught us that's not a good idea.

I keep thinking of George C Scott as the AF general in Dr Strangelove (not the psycho who launches the bombers).  Got him the prime role in Patton.

Division of power is a good thing .. but the billionaires and their crazy schemes, have subverted reality.  Just ask that Martian, Elon Musk.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newburgh_Conspiracy

Yeah, Washington had the conspirators shot in some cases.  Mutiny isn't allowed.
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Munch on March 09, 2017, 06:23:46 AM
I'll say this for J K Rowling, she might be a hypocrit in how she takes stabs at the uk for not taking in more refugees, when she owns property large enough to house several hundreds of them, but in regards to her latest tweet, kudos, very much kudos.

(http://i.imgur.com/KZP31KY.jpg)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=12TLq5fQPfk
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Baruch on March 09, 2017, 06:44:43 AM
Thanks for introducing me to Vicky Pollard ;-)  Next PM?
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: Munch on March 09, 2017, 07:32:25 AM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rxCPj40eFNc
Title: Re: Trump threatens to "send in the Feds" to fix Chicago homicide rate
Post by: fencerider on March 11, 2017, 07:13:30 PM
so a psycho bitch is holding the button for nuclear weapons....